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I, as well, call it quits after gray patches are returned. My cleaning rods are all Bore Tech and they've been excellent.
 

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As he states though he plans on shooting cast load in them. You have better luck with cast and reduce the change of leading if you get the copper fouling out of the bore.

On the other side I wonder if those two bore are pitted. Sometimes they never come clean.
 

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I have to agree with milprileb, I prefer to to see the bore condition at least once. I can not help but wonder how many layers of copper, grease and powder residue I have removed on some of these rifles. I shoot all of my rifles and just want to know the general condition of the barrel before I go to the range with it. I also feel that it is easier to clean a barrel after shooting if it is in a known condition.

I have had very good results with Butch's bore shine, and would recommend it; I will have to try the electronic bore cleaning as it looks really effective.
 

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For my modern sporting rifles, I shoot some carb cleaner down the bore and into various crevices in the BCG. I run a bore snake with some Hoppes #9 in the middle through the barrel. This usually gets all of the carbon out. Then I get the copper cleaner for the barrel. The foaming stuff works great for copper, but I've found it's not so good with carbon. YMMV. BTW, apparently carb cleaner is bad for combloc wood stocks, so I'm keeping that stuff away from my newer old acquisitions. There are commercial carbon cleaners that will get that crap out, but try a bore snake, it's easier.

Jim
 

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I built and used one a few years back but have since stopped. It is detailed here in greater detail: http://thedolk.com/borecleaner/index.html
A very good setup but can be simplified. You don't need a stainless rod since the bore crud plates onto the rod and any bare steel welding rod works fine.
And ammonia plus vinegar is overkill. All you need are some ions in the water and household ammonia is fine. Just wash it out with very hot plain water afterwards and grease or oil ASAP.

I wouldn't be surprised that the black or gray you are getting is just a form of rust appearing in the bore immediately after a cleaning, probably the magnetite oxide (Fe3O4), as in cold rust blue, not the common reddish rust (Fe2O3). Bullet jacket "copper" is usually either blue-green or, depending on the alloy, brown.
 

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Discussion Starter #27
wow..hadn't checked this thread for several days!! Thanks for all of the replies..even the OCD oriented ones..LOL. I readily admit to wanting to see the general condition of the bores,but am stopping when they get to gray patches as most advise.

These were so bad that the "black hole" effect was swallowing the bore light!! They are finally yielding results using the Tipton rod, and the M91 is finished, but after all my cleaning on the P/14, an overnight soaking of foaming bore cleaner yielded a bright blue ring again this am...it's like stripping a piece of heavily painted antique furniture.

I am planning to shoot my oversize cast loads through these since they are iron sighted, and am kinda(OCD?) hoping that the lead will polish them up a bit..if I live long enough.If not, the weapons and molds will go to my son who will continue the tradition.

I'd rather shoot these than my newer semi autos, cause they always attract questions at the range, and allow me to share my passion..OCD and all !!
 

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When I got my Ruger Compact in 7.62x39, You could clearly see the copper fouling in the lands. Hoppes. JB Bore paste and JB Bore bright did nothing. Still had some Butch's Bore shine. Few wet patches to thoroughly saturate the bore and a few passes with a 30 caliber bronze bore brush. Couple treatments cleaned all of what I could see. Some rifles don't take kindly being cleaned of all copper and powder fouling. So in that case you have to maintain a certain bore condition. Benchrest shooters regularly shoot to maintain that bore condition. Otherwise they have to shoot a few rounds to get that condition. I'v never seen a BR shooter really scrub a barrel. few solvent soaked patches, few strokes with either a nylon or bronze bore brush and wet patch a few times then dry patch. And that's it. Cast bullets usually means you get all the old copper or powder fouling out before doing cast bullets. And since I shoot cast bullets I do my best to have a copper and powder fouling bore as clean as possible. Frank
 
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