[1886lebel]

I pull this one with my 55 Chevy PU. View attachment 3926524

I drive by one on display every day to and from work which is located at the National Museum of Nuclear Science & History, it has the two prime movers attached to it.

Patrick

 

[Hag]

WWII and Korean War experienced Marine Corps NCO"s loathed the Carbine. Never saw a carbine during my infantry days in the Marines.
Acquired a carbine years ago. It had very poor accuracy with several different rounds. The design prevents accurizing.
The Garand I shot for qualification in the Marines blew the centers out of the targets at 500 yards.
General Patton is quoted stating his opinion that the Garand is the finest military rifle made.

 

[Pavia]

WWII and Korean War experienced Marine Corps NCO"s loathed the Carbine. Never saw a carbine during my infantry days in the Marines.
Acquired a carbine years ago. It had very poor accuracy with several different rounds. The design prevents accurizing.
The Garand I shot for qualification in the Marines blew the centers out of the targets at 500 yards.
General Patton is quoted stating his opinion that the Garand is the finest military rifle made.

My first carbine was terrible. Poor accuracy and reliability. But it was also a Universal.

The 1943 Inland I currently have is the exact opposite… a tack driver and no jams. The round itself is certainly no .30-06, but it’s no light pistol round either.

I’d go with the Garand or the Enfield.

 

[87mustang]

WWII and Korean War experienced Marine Corps NCO"s loathed the Carbine. Never saw a carbine during my infantry days in the Marines.
Acquired a carbine years ago. It had very poor accuracy with several different rounds. The design prevents accurizing.
The Garand I shot for qualification in the Marines blew the centers out of the targets at 500 yards.
General Patton is quoted stating his opinion that the Garand is the finest military rifle made.

IMO, Patton also died before the FAL, a weapon that was forced by the U.S. to be made 7.62 before they would agree to adopt it....... Then they still didn't. Many advantages over the Garand and I love and shoot both together consistently. The "Greatest weapon ever devised" Vs. "The Right Arm of the Free World". Not to get off topic, just opinion.
What kind of carbine did you buy that was so bad?

 

[Hag]

IMO, Patton also died before the FAL, a weapon that was forced by the U.S. to be made 7.62 before they would agree to adopt it....... Then they still didn't. Many advantages over the Garand and I love and shoot both together consistently. The "Greatest weapon ever devised" Vs. "The Right Arm of the Free World". Not to get off topic, just opinion.
What kind of carbine did you buy that was so bad?

It was traded to me by the Manager of a large gun store.
Pristine condition, like new. Don't remember the maker.
It shot six inch groups at 100 yards. This is probably ok because of its intended use in the military.
I gave it in a nice case and several mags as a graduation gift to a West Point graduate about fifteen years ago.

 

[Dallased]

Let's settle this. It is a crew served weapon though.

 

[shulepov1971]

SVT-40 for a long arm. Kinda surprised nobody else went with that. The late war German autos may be better, but I don't have any experience with them and don't own one. For a sidearm...? Probably a P38, but a 1911 is very close second.

Why didn't anyone say?
SVT-40 is my favorite rifle of World War II, I have an AVT-40 of 1944, this is the most perfect of the SVT serial samples.
But depending on the conditions of hostilities, I would still take a Mosin sniper rifle with a PU sight and a BRAMIT silencer for positional clashes and special exits. And for urban battles, landing and reconnaissance - PPS-43, the best PP of World War II ... Sudayev's most successful two-row magazine, along with 7,62x25, the most successful pistol cartridge in terms of ballistic characteristics of that time, which you can carry a lot on yourself.

 

[shulepov1971]

STG44 hands down. It was waaaaay ahead of it's time. It's design was based on a ton of actual combat evidence that fire fights during WWII rarely called for reaching out beyond two or three hundred yards. The intermediate 7.92x33 Kurz cartridge fit the bill perfectly.
The Russians followed right away with the SKS and AK and eventually we adopted the M16.

Yes, this is of course a wonderful example ... but it all started not with him, but with the MKb42 (H), which in the spring of 1943 was captured by the Red Army soldiers at the front from the Wehrmacht soldiers. And the command quickly sent this sample to the GRAU for research ... with 4 rounds.

In a total war, only a system that can quickly and adequately respond to a potential threat wins. The mechanism began to spin and in 1943 the cartridge that became famous for the Kalashnikov assault rifle was created, although it was at first 7.62x41.

Together with the SKS-45 and AK-47, a belt-fed light machine gun RPD-44 was created for one cartridge. Thus, in the department there was a weapon under one cartridge for everyone.

You can read an article by the respected Andrey Ulanov:

Штурмгевер.

Штурмгевер. Весной 1943 года офицеры стрелкового отдела ГАУ Красной Армии вполне могли быть довольными результатами своей работы. Казалось, что самое тяжелое уже позади – огромные потери оружия первых месяцев, эвакуация заводов, падение качества продукции – все это понемногу выправлялось. Уже осе...

gunsforum.com

 

[dersulzola76]

If I was serving in :
Royal Canadian Infantry LB Sten Mk2/ LB Browning HP
US Airborne M2 Carbine with folding stock/ 1911A1
Soviet naval infantry AVT40/ Hand grenades.
Soviet Penal battalion PPSH41/ Fighting knife
German panzer grenadiers STG44/ Panzer Faust

 

[shulepov1971]

If I was serving in :
Soviet naval infantry AVT40/ Hand grenades.
Soviet Penal battalion PPSH41/ Fighting knife
German panzer grenadiers STG44/ Panzer Faust

Excuse me, but the marines in the Red Fleet are a separate type of troops.
And there were penal battalions in each front, that is, a large formation in terms of numbers, where convicted officers of the Red Army served. There were eight fronts in the Red Army in May 1945 (Leningrad, 1st, 2nd and 3rd Belorussian, 1st, 2nd, 3rd and 4th Ukrainian). The names of the fronts are geographical, according to the place of hostilities, the field of crossing the border of the USSR, the fronts were not renamed.
Here are quotes from the Regulations on Penal Battalions of the Active Army, approved by Order of the People's Commissar of Defense of the USSR No. 298 on September 28, 1942:
"I. General Provisions
1. Penal battalions are intended to enable persons of middle and senior command, political and commanding staff of all branches of the armed forces, who are guilty of violating discipline due to cowardice or instability, to atone for their crimes against the Motherland with blood by a brave fight against the enemy in a more difficult area of combat operations ...
3. Penal battalions are under the jurisdiction of the military councils of the fronts. Within each front, from one to three penal battalions are created, depending on the situation.
III. About the penalty boxes
9. Persons of the middle and senior command, political and commanding staff are sent to penal battalions by order of a division or brigade (by corps - in relation to the personnel of corps units or by army and front - in relation to units of army and front subordination, respectively) for a period of one up to three months.
Persons of the middle and senior command, political and commanding staff convicted with the use of a suspended sentence (note 2 to article 28 of the Criminal Code of the RSFSR) can also be sent to penal battalions for the same periods by the verdict of military tribunals (the army and the rear). ...
11. Before being sent to a penal battalion, the penal is placed in front of the formation of his unit (unit), the order for the division or brigade (corps, army or front troops, respectively) is read out and the essence of the crime committed is explained.
15. For military distinction, a penal may be released ahead of schedule on the proposal of the command of the penal battalion, approved by the military council of the front.
For particularly outstanding military distinction, the penal, in addition, is presented to the government award.
Before leaving the penal battalion, the person released ahead of schedule is placed in front of the formation of the battalion, the order for early release is read out and the essence of the accomplished feat is explained.
16. Upon serving the appointed time, the penal battalions are presented by the command of the battalion to the military council of the front for release and, upon approval of the submission, are released from the penal battalion.
17. All released from the penal battalion are restored in rank and in all rights.
18. Penitentiaries who were wounded in battle are considered to have served their sentence, are reinstated in rank and in all rights, and upon recovery are sent for further service, and disabled people are assigned a pension from the salary of maintenance in the last position before being enrolled in a penal battalion.
19. The families of the dead penalized are assigned a pension on a common basis with all the families of the commanders from the salary of the last position until they are sent to the penal battalion.
Orders and medals from the penal are taken away and for the duration of his stay in the penal battalion are transferred for storage to the personnel department of the front.
The full text can be found for example here:

Положения о штрафных батальонах и штрафных ротах

The battalion of the Red Army has from 150 to 500 fighters, depending on the type of troops, the year and the state of the front.
But privates and sergeants (in your classification) could be sent to a penal company for a crime, also for 1-3 months, under similar conditions of service. Each army could have from 5 to 10 penal companies. There are from 160 to 180 fighters in a company.
Therefore, if you are not an officer, you would hardly be in the penal battalion of the Red Army.

And how are you going to get out of the tank hatch with a panzerfaust in battle?

 

[sean4570]

PPSH41 or Thompson M1928 SMG.

This, in that order

 

[87mustang]

6 inch at 100 yards. That's pretty bad for a carbine. I don't blame you for making it a gift. All I ever owned were tack drivers.

It was traded to me by the Manager of a large gun store.
Pristine condition, like new. Don't remember the maker.
It shot six inch groups at 100 yards. This is probably ok because of its intended use in the military.
I gave it in a nice case and several mags as a graduation gift to a West Point graduate about fifteen years ago.

6 inch at 100 yards. That's pretty bad for a carbine. I don't blame you for making it a gift. All I ever owned were tack drivers.

 

[bodes]

I'm not sure the M1 carbine's original purpose was that of a frontline type of weapon....Seems to me these were designed for use by rear echelon troops such as cooks, or as a lightweight defensive weapon for tankers or artillerymen....A weapon to carry or do one's task where the bulkier, heavier M1 garand might get in the way....Was meant to augment or replace the .45 pistol...Bodes

 

[tacfoley2]

MG 42.

...and the truck to carry all the ammunition...........................................................

 

[John A. Larsen]

Google "images of Alamo Scouts in WWII" some great photos, and look at how many of them are carrying M1 carbines. Light, Non-corrosive ammunition and the ability to defend yourself, IF you make contact, as your mission is reconnaissance. As far as Marine NCO's loathing the carbine, in 1965 I was a Phu Bai, when the Marines showed up. We had to go to Danang to return some parachutes, and brought back a jeep trailer with M1/M2 carbines and M3 Grease guns, magazines and ammunition. The Marine TOE for a Platoon had the Platoon Leader, the Gunnery SGT and something they called the "Right Guide" if I remember correctly with just a M1911A1 .45 pistol. This carbines and Grease guns disappeared as soon as they were offered (not traded, just given out) as most of the NCO's had served in the Corps when the M1 Garand, Grease Gun and carbine were issued and were familiar with them. The French both in India China and Algeria used a lot of M1 carbines. In 1975 we came out of the field at Larson Kaserne and meet the French 13th Dragoons, their Army level Reconnaissance unit and they were armed with M1A1 carbines. Small, light and again gave them the ability to defend themselves if contact was made, fighting was not their main purpose. It was somewhat embarrassing when their Commander, a LTC said to stay proficient they fired 50 rounds a month, how many rounds a month did we fire with our XM16E1's? This was shortly after the Army went to 40 rounds a year for qualification, with about 10 rounds to Zero, and that is what we normally had for firing for the entire year. John

 

[panzerfaust44]

I'm not sure the M1 carbine's original purpose was that of a frontline type of weapon....Seems to me these were designed for use by rear echelon troops such as cooks, or as a lightweight defensive weapon for tankers or artillerymen....A weapon to carry or do one's task where the bulkier, heavier M1 garand might get in the way....Was meant to augment or replace the .45 pistol...Bodes

X2 on that.

I also read the same thing.

 

[87mustang]

I'm not sure the M1 carbine's original purpose was that of a frontline type of weapon....Seems to me these were designed for use by rear echelon troops such as cooks, or as a lightweight defensive weapon for tankers or artillerymen....A weapon to carry or do one's task where the bulkier, heavier M1 garand might get in the way....Was meant to augment or replace the .45 pistol...Bodes

X 3 on that. I have also never encountered marines or NCO's who "loathed" the carbine.

 

[Pavia]

Let's settle this. It is a crew served weapon though.

View attachment 3927406

Probably for grenades. As the saying goes… If it looks stupid, but works… it’s not stupid.

 

[Pavia]

Interesting comments on the Carbine. Would you choose an M1 Carbine over an SKS in Vietnam?

 

[Pavia]

Google "images of Alamo Scouts in WWII" some great photos, and look at how many of them are carrying M1 carbines. Light, Non-corrosive ammunition and the ability to defend yourself, IF you make contact, as your mission is reconnaissance. As far as Marine NCO's loathing the carbine, in 1965 I was a Phu Bai, when the Marines showed up. We had to go to Danang to return some parachutes, and brought back a jeep trailer with M1/M2 carbines and M3 Grease guns, magazines and ammunition. The Marine TOE for a Platoon had the Platoon Leader, the Gunnery SGT and something they called the "Right Guide" if I remember correctly with just a M1911A1 .45 pistol. This carbines and Grease guns disappeared as soon as they were offered (not traded, just given out) as most of the NCO's had served in the Corps when the M1 Garand, Grease Gun and carbine were issued and were familiar with them. The French both in India China and Algeria used a lot of M1 carbines. In 1975 we came out of the field at Larson Kaserne and meet the French 13th Dragoons, their Army level Reconnaissance unit and they were armed with M1A1 carbines. Small, light and again gave them the ability to defend themselves if contact was made, fighting was not their main purpose. It was somewhat embarrassing when their Commander, a LTC said to stay proficient they fired 50 rounds a month, how many rounds a month did we fire with our XM16E1's? This was shortly after the Army went to 40 rounds a year for qualification, with about 10 rounds to Zero, and that is what we normally had for firing for the entire year. John

Awesome story. Thanks. In 1965, I was in a Dayton, OH hospital being born.

It’s even worse today. Some Army units don’t even qualify on a KD range. They shoot small targets at 25m.