Gunboards Forums banner

1 - 2 of 2 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,734 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Cruffler
Posted - 04/05/2006 : 6:40:39 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
A buddy bought this at auction. He wanted to know what it is and approximate value before he moves it along.

http://old.gunboards.com/uploaded/cruffler/20064518383_vet.JPG
Download Attachment:
11.64 KB



DocAV
Posted - 04/05/2006 : 7:44:22 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Vetterli M1870 cavalry carbine ( for use in metropolitan Italy from 1870 to 1893 or so (when replaced by M91 CC).

Different from the Rifle M1870, which underwent conversion to a 4-shot magazine in 1887, the standard issue M70 CC never underwent conversion, and remained as a single shot till replaced by the M91 in 6,5mm.
The only exception is the 500 pieces M70/1888 conversions for Eritrea (Rare as hen's teeth...THREE known in collections world-wide)

Cavalry carbines M70 are usually quite uncommon, especially with the spike bayonet still attached.

As to value, I would leave it to other collectors in the USA to comment. Down Under there have not been sighted ANY M70sCCs and only ONE M70/88 Eritrean CC(Mine).



dgv2
Posted - 04/06/2006 : 12:36:43 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cruffler,

If you want to see a whole bunch of them at once, look closely at the Munchkin Army parade in the "Wizard of Oz" movie.



dg13
Posted - 04/08/2006 : 9:21:08 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Doc AV I have one with the clip added--is this the one you are refering to?
dg13



Ronin48
Posted - 04/16/2006 : 9:36:19 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Last one I saw for sale was in the $500 range and that was bout 10 years back. I have two, paid $375 for first (no b'net) and a Beretta Vett conversion to .22 cal, tghis in late 80s or early 90s. Tickled pink to get both together for that price, walked around the show holding rifles and grinning like a jackass eating briars!

Picked up a second with b'net later for around $300. Not sure about last price. No idea what one would sell for today, saw a 70/87/15 at last show, asking price was $300, so cav. carb. with b'net should be somewhere in the $500-$800 range??? That's a wild-ass guess!



GJD
Posted - 05/16/2006 : 5:36:11 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I just purchased a M70 Cav. Carbine from JoeSalter.com for $495. Good bore. Missing bayonet though. I wonder how the recoil is with the 10.4x47R cartridge?



DocAV
Posted - 05/17/2006 : 12:26:56 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
dg13, do you have a Cav Carbine Vetterli with added Vitali magazine, or a common Vetterli Vitali TS Short rifle ( whichj were converted in 1887)???
From my resources in Italy, the CC (Eritrea)Vetterli-Vitali were almost all "Lost" during the various battles in East Africa(Dogali, 1889, Adowa 1896, 1920s, Abyssinian campaign 1935-36, Loss of AOI, 1941.)
It could be quite possible that some made it by various means to the US over the postwar years, either as a "wallhanger" souvenir, of from subsequent user countries(India, British African colonies, etc).

My particular example came back to Queensland, Australia in 1928-29, in the hands of a retiring Surveyor-General of the Sudan, who had "picked it up" some time during his service in the Sudan from the First WW to the mid 20s.(Sudan has a long Border with Italian Eritrea and Ethiopia...cross-border trade of guns is common, as the nomadic herdsmen travel both ways with their cattle.)



JPS
Posted - 05/17/2006 : 05:21:43 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yo Cruffler,

Please tell your friend that I will pay $500 for the Vetterli carbine if he decides to sell it and considers this offer acceptable.



Cruffler
Posted - 05/17/2006 : 6:27:42 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by JPS
Yo Cruffler,
Please tell your friend that I will pay $500 for the Vetterli carbine if he decides to sell it and considers this offer acceptable.
I'll pm you when I get in touch with him. He doesn't have a computer.



dg13
Posted - 05/17/2006 : 9:57:36 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DocAV
I've got examples of both. Regular calvery carbine w bayo and a Cav Carbine Vetterli with added Vitali magazine. In other talks with Itallian collectors I knew it was quite rare but did not know they were as rare as you say. "From my resources in Italy, the CC (Eritrea)Vetterli-Vitali were almost all "Lost" during the various battles in East Africa(Dogali, 1889, Adowa 1896, 1920s, Abyssinian campaign 1935-36, Loss of AOI, 1941.)" It certainly is not a "beater" but is in very good condition. Some blue turning to a nice patina.



DocAV
Posted - 05/19/2006 : 07:15:16 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well dg13, join the select few. from an Italian Book on Piedmontese and Italian Cavalry small arms, 1815-1918, the Fondo Eritreo (Eritrea Fund office, predecessor of the Italian Colonial service) ordered 500 Vetterli CCs to be converted to the Vitali magazine system in 1888; these were subsequently delivered to Asmara (Eritrea) by the 1890s, for issue to the native cavalry. The officers (Italians) had Winchester lever-actions carbines(??M1873 Turkish??) acquired locally.

The book also mentioned ( 1980s) that there were Two examples of the Eritrean Carbines known in Italy, one in a museum, and one viewed privately by one of the authors. I thought I had the third, with definite provenance, as I mentioned. The Book also mentions that the Eritrean order was the only instance of Vetterli Cavalry Carbines being converted to Vitali magazines
Looks like you have the Fourth known out of 500. Rare...I would call that extremely rare.... (less than 1% survival rate).



dg13
Posted - 05/22/2006 : 8:01:42 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thank you Doc AV for the information. I will try to post pictures in the next month or 2.



dg13
Posted - 06/22/2006 : 8:19:22 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here is the Carbine DocAV. Thanks again for your explaination!

http://old.gunboards.com/uploaded/dg13/2006622201752_IMG_0025-1.jpg
Download Attachment:
17.7 KB
http://old.gunboards.com/uploaded/dg13/2006622201815_IMG_0026-2.jpg
Download Attachment:
65.86 KB
http://old.gunboards.com/uploaded/dg13/2006622201830_IMG_0031-1.jpg
Download Attachment:
60.75 KB
http://old.gunboards.com/uploaded/dg13/2006622201847_IMG_0033-1.jpg
Download Attachment:
15.71 KB
http://old.gunboards.com/uploaded/dg13/200662220190_IMG_0032-1.jpg
Download Attachment:
25.44 KB
http://old.gunboards.com/uploaded/dg13/2006622201914_IMG_0034-1.jpg
Download Attachment:
22.1 KB

.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,734 Posts
Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Douglas I. Kerley
Posted - 06/25/2006 : 12:24:11 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi; Young member walks in with this nearly 100% Vet. Carbine single shot with bayonet today. Sad thing about it was that the dumb rear sight is missing. Any chance of coming up with one? I was ready to scrap out a 6.5 for the sight untill I saw the PIC below and the goofy little sight. Might have to fab one up. Doug
 
1 - 2 of 2 Posts
Top