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That's the first I've heard of that, though I can't quite agree with your assessment of "brittle brass" being the entire cause. If you want to run ammo that clocks 3200 fps through your vintage rifles, that's your call. I won't do it. I've been called foolhardy before, but that just seems foolish to me.
 

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That's the first I've heard of that, though I can't quite agree with your assessment of "brittle brass" being the entire cause. If you want to run ammo that clocks 3200 fps through your vintage rifles, that's your call. I won't do it. I've been called foolhardy before, but that just seems foolish to me.
Original spec for this ammo is right around 3000ish... 3200 isn't a big deal given some variance in lot to lot velocity.

You can handload and get that if you want.

If it's not brittle brass then what is it?
 

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That's the first I've heard of that, though I can't quite agree with your assessment of "brittle brass" being the entire cause. If you want to run ammo that clocks 3200 fps through your vintage rifles, that's your call. I won't do it. I've been called foolhardy before, but that just seems foolish to me.
Roger that...they talk about “normal pressure and port pressure” when that 3200fps IS NOT the spec for German WW1 7.92 type S ball in a 29 inch GEW98 barrel.
 

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Roger that...they talk about “normal pressure and port pressure” when that 3200fps IS NOT the spec for German WW1 7.92 type S ball in a 29 inch GEW98 barrel.
Yeah its actually a little over spec and still was safe in semis....thats even more proof it isn't an issue.
 

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Yes, over spec. Not “around 3000ish”, but 2891fps in a GEW 98 rifle.
From German 7.9 Military Ammunition 1888-1945, Daniel W.Kent.
Taken at 78ft...when at 15ft its closer to 2950. So yeah...3000ish...

and even over spec ammo is still safe in gas guns...kinda destroys the narrative.
 

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Taken at 78ft...when at 15ft its closer to 2950. So yeah...3000ish...

and even over spec ammo is still safe in gas guns...kinda destroys the narrative.
25 meters Jeremy..US Army tests at 78 feet. I will let you do the math. Sure “over spec Ammo” is safe in gas guns. You say so ...it has to be true. Noting can harm a gas gun. Wait! G43s are already “over gassed” you say? But then can over spec ammo harm an over gassed gun. No? because you say it is “still safe“.

The narrative is that you talk in absolutes. “Turk Ammo is safe” when you mean “A reload can be made with Turk components in some semi autos“.

“Over spec ammo is safe in gas guns” when you will not even shoot “In Spec“ Ammo in your un modified German semi autos.

There is going to be two camps here... Me? I shoot my 1952 Turk in bolt guns. No hassle, little worry.
 

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25 meters Jeremy..US Army tests at 78 feet. I will let you do the math. Sure “over spec Ammo” is safe in gas guns. You say so ...it has to be true. Noting can harm a gas gun. Wait! G43s are already “over gassed” you say? But then can over spec ammo harm an over gassed gun. No? because you say it is “still safe“.

The narrative is that you talk in absolutes. “Turk Ammo is safe” when you mean “A reload can be made with Turk components in some semi autos“.

“Over spec ammo is safe in gas guns” when you will not even shoot “In Spec“ Ammo in your un modified German semi autos.

There is going to be two camps here... Me? I shoot my 1952 Turk in bolt guns. No hassle, little worry.
oops...ok 82ft not 78ft. So that means the 15ft vel is even higher than at 78ft.


You are still hung up on a G43 and I can't figure out why...

Please explain what the difference is between turk ammo and the turk components in new brass.

Back to the G43 again...so again..you condone all G43 shooters to shoot them with no modifications? It's your statement that they aren't overgassed?

Sure have two camps....those that understand that actual issue...and those that don't. If the turk brass wasn't brittle...we wouldn't be having this conversation.
 

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No offense intended, but I don't know you. You might be a legitimate metallurgist who has scientifically tested Turk brass to determine it's degree of "brittleness", or you might be just some guy making assumptions. I don't know, so you'll have to excuse me for not taking your word for it. When you go against a widely accepted explanation and common knowledge, and set yourself up as having all the answers such that everyone else is wrong, you need to have an exceptional degree of evidence. You haven't convinced me. I just see a guy telling me how he's right and all the experts are wrong.

Maybe you're right, maybe you're wrong. It's been interesting considering it, and thank you for your input and that photo. I remain unconvinced though. I will never run full power Turk ammo through my FN49. If I'm going to go to the effort of pulling and reloading surplus ammo, decreasing the powder charge to a more reasonable velocity for these old guns is a no-brainer, for me.

By the way, I wouldn't dismiss the 3200fps velocity as "just a little over spec". To be honest that dismissal weakens your argument. As a long-time reloader, I know that 250fps over a full load is a substantial overload. A little scary actually. The rifle will probably hold up OK for a while, as it's likely within the safety margin, but it is very concerning, definitely not "just a little over".
 

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When you go against a widely accepted explanation and common knowledge... ...all the experts are wrong.
Well the widely accepted explanation and "common knowledge" don't hold water under scrutiny.

What "experts"?


Maybe you're right, maybe you're wrong. It's been interesting considering it, and thank you for your input and that photo. I remain unconvinced though. I will never run full power Turk ammo through my FN49. If I'm going to go to the effort of pulling and reloading surplus ammo, decreasing the powder charge to a more reasonable velocity for these old guns is a no-brainer, for me.

By the way, I wouldn't dismiss the 3200fps velocity as "just a little over spec". To be honest that dismissal weakens your argument. As a long-time reloader, I know that 250fps over a full load is a substantial overload. A little scary actually. The rifle will probably hold up OK for a while, as it's likely within the safety margin, but it is very concerning, definitely not "just a little over".
3200 is easily attainable with handloads and within spec. according to quickload. The 3200 is only about 5% above what the WW1 spec is. US M2 ball loads have this much variance as well so no real concern there either.

Gotta look at it with facts not feelings. That gets you every time...

You never said what you broke in your FN49
 

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Like I told a former co-worker one time, who thought he was the smartest guy in the room and always won every argument; sometimes when people stop talking to you it doesn't necessarily mean you've won the argument, but rather that everyone else has decided that you're so arrogant and full of it that there's no point in any further discussion.

It's clear to me that you don't understand nearly so much as you think you do, and are arrogantly defending an indefensible position. Anyone who advocates overloading 70+ year old rifles the way you are deserves to be ignored.
 

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Again risking several thousand dollars worth of firearm with three cent ammo - well, at least some rare parts may be available soon.
 

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Like I told a former co-worker one time, who thought he was the smartest guy in the room and always won every argument; sometimes when people stop talking to you it doesn't necessarily mean you've won the argument, but rather that everyone else has decided that you're so arrogant and full of it that there's no point in any further discussion.

It's clear to me that you don't understand nearly so much as you think you do, and are arrogantly defending an indefensible position. Anyone who advocates overloading 70+ year old rifles the way you are deserves to be ignored.
Interesting...I ask you questions to clarify on comments you made and you won't answer...

Stating the turk ammo is safe for semis if you put it in new brass is "indefensible"?? Overloading?? LOL...ok..
 

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This thread is just an irresistible force vs an immovable object.

Bye
 

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Discussion Starter #57 (Edited)
I did not intend this thread to turn into a pissing match about the safety of Turkish ammo in semi automatic rifles. Thanks to those who contributed and responded to my original question about reducing the powder charge to shoot in bolt action rifles. It turns out the crack in the wrist was an old one that opened up. It has since been fixed and is no longer an issue.
 

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What you propose may constitute a Liability to site owners and actual danger to others. From a legal standpoint i recommend the Mods take appropriate action before its too late.
 

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What you propose may constitute a Liability to site owners and actual danger to others. From a legal standpoint i recommend the Mods take appropriate action before its too late.
What have I proposed? I mean I'm not the one shooting ammo with cracks in the brass like you are. That's pretty irresponsible since no one recommends shooting ammo like that.

I mean if you are here just to stir things up...
 

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Guess I missed all the hooplah.
All I know is that my inexpensive bolt-actions get hot or suspect or Turkish or corrosive ammo, not my my $3000-ish G43. Just sayin'.......
 
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