[cbanker101]

I posted this on the Nagant forum originally. Can anyone here tell me about the SS medallion and what it was used for? Below is a link to the thread.

Thanks in advance,

Cbanker


http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?t=78087

 

[pzjgr]

Its a Gestapo Warrant disc...its a repro of course...basically Gestapo (Geheimnes Stadt Polizei, simply Secret City Police) agents in plain clothes carried this tag, with their "badge number" if you will on it, it allowed them arrest powers regardless of jurisdiction, and guaranteed the co-operation of any police organization...

 

[Matz]

I'm not sure it's either. I'm by no means an expert but, I don't think that the Gestapo was a part of the SS. Go to the Wehrmacht-Awards.com. and run it by those guys, they will give you a reply most rick-e- tick. Matz.

 

[pzjgr]

Yeah, actually Matz is right...its not a Gestapo warrant tag, I made a snap judgement...and its Geheimnes Staat Polizei, or Secret State Police...

I did find a few web sites that showed this, and none of them seem to know exactly what this might have been used for....but I would still say its either a repro or an all out fantasy piece....as I said in the PM, I think that couple in Michigan that published "Papers Please" used to sell these...

 

[cbanker101]

from what I found on website, this seems to be an "SS ID tag" that was used to mark weapons and or ammo. Im assuming it was for shippments and tracking was done by the SN.

I did find pics of warrant disks and they are oval in shape and have a large eagle on one side.

 

[cbanker101]

It's a fake SS dog-tag. These were some of the crude fake stuff that was made around the late 1970's. There are a number of different types - Gestapo, Waffen SS, SS Heimwehr Danzig, etc. Some, like the best of the Gestapo i.d. tags, were good copies of originals. Others were poorer copies, or hokey looking fantasy pieces like this one.

well, rather than simply calling this a ridiculous fake, can some post a pic of an authentic one? Did the fakes have sn#'s? Am looking to compare fonts, etc.

 

[Matz]

It's a fake SS dog-tag. These were some of the crude fake stuff that was made around the late 1970's. There are a number of different types - Gestapo, Waffen SS, SS Heimwehr Danzig, etc. Some, like the best of the Gestapo i.d. tags, were good copies of originals. Others were poorer copies, or hokey looking fantasy pieces like this one.

I have quite a few German "dog tags", and this is not even a good fake. ID tags are oval in shape and none have a deaths head on them. This is a fantasy piece. As is said before, go to Wehrmacht-Awards .com. They have pics of ID tags, Gestapo disc, ect.

 

[Bill_in_VA]

On the left is a Gestapo warrant disk (with apologies to Rosenberg at MCF for borrowing his photos.) On the right is a grouping of Third Reich ID tags ("dog tags.") The square one is a POW dog tag (i.e., an allied serviceman held as prisoner of war); the other three are military. I hate to further disappoint you, but the others are correct: your "SS disk" is a pure fantasy piece.

 

[denny gaither]

Yeah, actually Matz is right...its not a Gestapo warrant tag, I made a snap judgement...and its Geheimnes Staat Polizei, or Secret State Police...

As a point of clarification; it's actually Geheime Staats Polizei = Gestapo.

 

[Big commander]

Denny Gaither is right of course, to be 100% correct, in the original German language, it should be written as: "Geheime Staatspolizei".
I'm not a collector of medallions nor a connoisseur but, being not so young anymore, there are two things that struck me.
The first is the "varnished copper" view/aspect of the item, honestly it reminds me of the objects one could find (and acquire) in the gum ball machines of the 50thies and 60thies (electrolysis). It would be interesting to see if this item wasn't "copper cladded" and then varnished to protect the thin layer of copper.
The second red flag (for me) is the division sign after the word "Berlin" and certainly the full stop after "1939". IMHO there is no need for these on an item like this is supposed to be (typographically it would be a sin).
I may be wrong, I sincerely hope so for the owner, but I wouldn't spend any money on this medal.

 

[cbanker101]

I know there has been discussion on this topic already, but here are links to others selling repros.


in the below link, the medal is referenced as a waffen SS ID tag

http://www.militaria-net.co.uk/osco...d/312?osCsid=7d3dd30a33dbf51e569a301e064e2226


in the link below, scroll down half way and its under the "Political Badges" section

http://www.milprom.com/German/badges/index.htm


in the below link, its shown as SS Tag (scroll halfway down)

http://www.battleorders.co.uk/acatalog/MILITARIA.html


I found another site that described these as being tags for weapons or ammo shipments.

I don't mean to keep bringing this up, but if these tags were pure fantasy, then why are so many repro companies selling them? Whether mine is fake or not is somewhat irrelavant to me at this point. I'm now just trying to figure out what these were for, or if they never existed at all.

 

[Bill_in_VA]

I don't mean to keep bringing this up, but if these tags were pure fantasy, then why are so many repro companies selling them? Whether mine is fake or not is somewhat irrelavant to me at this point. I'm now just trying to figure out what these were for, or if they never existed at all.

Simply because many companies sell a badge like yours is no indicator that it's either original or a copy of a legitimate badge. There are thousands of so-called "SS pocket knives"/"Hitler presentation pocket knives" all over the place (I seem to run across one at least every other month in my prowls through junque stores/antique malls/flea markets) yet they're well-known fake/make-belive/fantasy pieces. As far as the vendors you've listed, much of what they offer for sale also indicates thaty have no idea what they're selling (ex. the SS EM buckle offered for sale as a "German Army Officer's Buckle" for £15.00 is not just mis-identified, but the price alone (details too) give it away as a bad fake.
With regards to your badge, aside from the obvious (i.e, collectors' input, known examples, etc...), the details are all wrong...poor quality, font, skull shape (what's with the chubby-baby cheeks??? (that's rhetorical, btw)), color, etc... You've been directed to post your photos at Wehrmacht Awards.com and the Militaria Collecting Forum ( http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/forums/index.php and http://www.militariacollecting.com/ )...two of the largest Third Reich collectors' fourms. Post there. They'll tell you the same thign (consider too, many of here at Tucos also post at both WAF and MCF...a lot of us collect more than just guns. ) Likewise, I've posted what a legitimate SS ID tag looks like, as well as a Gestapo warrant disk and yours matches neither. I'm sure if you googled "SS ID tag" or Gestapo warrant disk" you'd see other photos of legitmate ones.
I guess what many of us are trying to say is that regardless of the evidence posted...opinions and input from experienced collectors, photos, advice, etc... if you wish to continue in the belief that it's a legitimate piece, so be it; but that doesn't change the facts.
HTH

 

[J.Stein]

the details are all wrong...poor quality, font, skull shape (what's with the chubby-baby cheeks??? (that's rhetorical, btw)), color, etc...
HTH

That's not a Death's Head. That's actually the cartoon character Squidward from SpongeBob Squarepants. I swear its dead on.

If any of the rest of you have little ones you'll recognize him too.

 

[cbanker101]

fair enough. Thanks all for the input.