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Gold Bullet Member
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
...Received the SCW Mosin Nagant that I started a recent thread about today. Happy with this rifle, but one detail threw me for a loop. Took the rifle down and found no surprises other than no rust or pitting under the wood and nice blueing. Stock has a good remnant of a Tula star on the right and date and remnants of other circular marks. Bottom of stock under the rear escutcheons has faint remnants of red and yellow paint (flag colors). Some of the dings have wood filler in them. Here's the surprise. Pulled the butt plate off and there in neatly stamped letters is the name "PAGE". First thought, some collector put his name on there. No big deal it's hidden. But thought about that a bit and then started a search for Abraham Lincoln Brigade soldiers names.

Found the Lincoln Brigade archives and Thomas Page. Young black man born in New York in 1909. Bootlegger in the early thirties and joined the Communist party in 1934. Went to Spain in March '37. Started as a truck driver with the Republicans and then transferred to a machine gun company. Then promoted to squad leader. Cited twice for bravery, fought in the Ebro offensive and was badly wounded and hospitalized. Got back to the states sometime in 1938 I think. Joined the US army for WWII and served in Africa, Italy and France. Quite a soldier. Died in 1985. Could it be his or like I said, some collector stamped his own same name on there? Tula didn't stamp "PAGE" on the rifle butts.

I never buy a story, only the gun. The name was not mentioned by the seller and the rifle was represented as a Mosin Nagant rifle, not a SCW MN rifle. Know ya'll wanna' know, two forty five and the invoice didn't show a shipping charge.

Low serial barrel mated to Star 36 stamped tang receiver. That should be right?

Bore, sadly is...FINE. Sharp lands and grooves and no corrosion. Every metal piece has a Tula star cept the all Izhevsk bolt. Matching barrel, floor plate and butt plate. Rifle is tight.

Metal is coated with a sticky something that is not cosmoline. Will post more photos when I get this crazy rifle cleaned up.

Photos.

Lancebear
 

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I have been excited to see this rifle for a week now. Nice find! What I really want to know now is what is the rifle with the really sharp looking stock above the SCW in the photos? What a show stealer! I wonder if it was common for soldiers to put heir last names under the buttplate, or if that was something different entirely? Regardless I am going to check mine out now! BTW the bore looks great in those pics. Are you going to fire it?
Mat!_SW
 

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Copper Bullet member
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Great piece of history. Maybe somebody humped it but I don't see how that would make any sense. You might even be able to get ahold of Page's next of kin; could be some photos or letters corroborating his issue MN.
You inspired me to remove the buttplates off of my two SCWs and have a look. No names but both have an ink stamp: a rectangle with what looks like 'MI8' or 'M1B'; I can't really make them out, even with a magnifying glass. Here are a couple of (not good) photos to show what I am talking about. The `37 Ishevsk also has a very small pre 28 bow and arrow stamp along with what looks like the letter T.
 

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Diamond with Oak Clusters Bullet Member
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I don't know of any groups, units, organizations active during the SCW that would have the acronym "PAGE", but my thought was that it was an arsenal or service depot stamping.
 

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Wow, very spectacular... Want 250 for it? Heh. Kidding aside, that is very cool. I'm glad you did all the research on it. Some Abe Lincoln/ MacPap vets actually brought their 91/30s home with them. Bill Bailey for example. I do not want to make things overly complicated, but the "Made in the USSR" stamp indicates it was a rifle that remained in Spain, was refurbished during the Franco years, and then exported to the US in the 50s. "PAGE" is clearly a possible English last name, but don't overlook the possibility that there may have been a Brit/ Welsh/ UK or similar international brigade person who was issued the rifle. Like Bob in St.L says up post, you should also isolate the possibility that it is a Spanish acronym. Certainly it is not a Spanish word, but perhaps some kind of Acronym. The Nationalists kept the red and yellow Spanish flag, but the Republic used a red-yellow-purple tricolor. It is highly unlikely that any overt Republican symbol would have been left on a gun, but then again, who in the world would check under the buttplate? The cleaning rod is also indicative of SCW.

PS: Very nice M39 too with the flaming birch! ;)
 

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Its been ten years since my last spanish class but could the word "PAGE" be one of the preterits for "pagar" which means: to make good, check out, return, discharge, let in?

So the stock "it would be good" "it checks out" "return it" "discharge it" "let it in"

Or, I could be way off.
 

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Could well be trench art. Good for you doing a little historical research on the scw and ALB. I met a member of the Abraham Lincoln brigade in Palo Alto California back in the late 70's. He owned a rare book store and I was perusing some of his many many neat books. I own three scw veteran rifles, neither of the m/n have such a nice bore.
to paraphrase Pete Seeger speaking of his banjo
"this gun kills facsits"
gil
 

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But why stamped instead of carved and in a hidden place? To heck with it. In the absence of contrary evidence I say hang on to your story.

You inspired me to remove the buttplates off of my two SCWs and have a look. No names but both have an ink stamp: a rectangle with what looks like 'MI8' or 'M1B'; I can't really make them out, even with a magnifying glass. Here are a couple of (not good) photos to show what I am talking about. The `37 Ishevsk also has a very small pre 28 bow and arrow stamp along with what looks like the letter T.
Definately sounds like the Francoist inspection marks described in other threads.
 

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Nice weapon.

I do not leap on the PAGE being the name of the soldier mentioned.

Fact is : Soldiers do not carry stamps around to engrave their stocks. If it were inked on or penciled in script....this story could prove convincing.

Not to rain on your parade but its highly doubtful Page had a stamp for his name and hammered it into the butt under the butt plate.

No... that dog will not hunt for me but if you believe it, enjoy the rifle and good luck.
 

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I don't believe this for a minute, as there's very little chance/no chance that any Lincoln would've had access to a letter stamp set--In most armies, any soldier removing a fixed permanent part of the stock, like a buttplate, would probably be severely disciplined. More likely a US owner did that, sometime in the 50 years since it was imported into the country via Interarms. There is every chance that rifle has had 10 different owners since importation.
Alternatively, the Spanish armorer stamping theory makes a lot of sense.
Fwiw, those AL and GW volunteers were living and being killed in mud and filth and didn't have much access to clothing, food and ammunition, much less tooling and stamping dies.
 

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Well there is one possibility that I did not think about till now.

What IF: what if the real soldier named Page bought this rifle as a surplus weapon in the 50-60's and then stamped his name on it ? Now that might be a possibility and if one could trace his family down and
ask if he had such a rifle ....it might turn out this was his weapon.

Anyhow: whoever this soldier Page was, he certainly was not shy about going to war and fighting for his convictions. The SCW and WWII were deadly events and he volunteered for both.
 

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Gold Bullet Member
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
I have been excited to see this rifle for a week now. Nice find! What I really want to know now is what is the rifle with the really sharp looking stock above the SCW in the photos? What a show stealer! I wonder if it was common for soldiers to put heir last names under the buttplate, or if that was something different entirely? Regardless I am going to check mine out now! BTW the bore looks great in those pics. Are you going to fire it?
Mat!_SW
Mat!

I would fire it and will someday, it's solid. The flaming birch rifle is a Finn M39, straight stock, '41 Sako. I posted it a while ago.

LB
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
I don't know of any groups, units, organizations active during the SCW that would have the acronym "PAGE", but my thought was that it was an arsenal or service depot stamping.
Hey Bob,

I think you are probably right. I looked today and found nothing on a "PAGE" acronym or whatever. Unknown arsenal stamp or something like that, and like I wrote some former owner's mark maybe. And "Page" is not in the Spanish language far as I could find out. Thanks for your recent information and help.

The Tom Page bio synopsis was just a fun coincidence, and he was an interesting man. He is in a documentary about the war called "The Good Fight" or something like that.

I knew the rifle couldn't be a bringback because of the Made In USSR stamp.

Lancebear
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Great piece of history. Maybe somebody humped it but I don't see how that would make any sense. You might even be able to get ahold of Page's next of kin; could be some photos or letters corroborating his issue MN.
You inspired me to remove the buttplates off of my two SCWs and have a look. No names but both have an ink stamp: a rectangle with what looks like 'MI8' or 'M1B'; I can't really make them out, even with a magnifying glass. Here are a couple of (not good) photos to show what I am talking about. The `37 Ishevsk also has a very small pre 28 bow and arrow stamp along with what looks like the letter T.
Coastie,

Thanks for your effort, more info for the MN data base. Is that the sound of SCW MN butt plates popping off around the country I hear...maybe another "Page" stamp will show up tonight. He may have had more than one rifle:).

LB
 
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