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Swedish Rolling Block
Printed from: Gunboards
Topic URL: http://old.gunboards.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=93407
Printed on: 09/10/2007
Topic:
Topic author: moke
Subject: Swedish Rolling Block
Posted on: 03/06/2005 4:40:44 PM
Message:

I recently purchased a rolling block action.On the right side is a capital "H" and 1872 date.The main spring,barrel,forend,stock and extractor are missing.I now know the maker is Husqvarna and caliber was 12.7 X 42R(rimfire).My question(s) are.Are these actions exact copies of remingtons? What is the barrel thread pitch and major diameter? Can I safely convert to 45/70 or simular?Will remington #1 stock and or barrels fit?.Action is in very good condition with lite pitting on left side.Retaining screw and sliding extractor are missing.Can I use a later remington front block (CF) with rotary extractor?I wish I had all the original parts to restore to original but don't.I don't want to anger any of or Swedish brothers out there! Thank You.
Replies:
Reply author: Fushigi Ojisan
Replied on: 03/06/2005 11:07:21 PM
Message:

I managed to secure an intact M1889 action with rotary extractor.

Yes, it can handle .45-70, in fact, some hot rodders are rebarreling
them for .50-90.

The thing I found when building mine is that barrel blanks need to be
threaded for the application, so thread pitch is irrelevant for this discussion. New stocks (used www.treebonecarving.com for mine) will require some kind of fitting.

To be honest, I would go to www.kebcollc.com and email asking about complete actions and sporterized rifles. Trust me, its a money pit starting with a complete action--so its just that much more you have to spend to get to my starting point!

May as well look for a good gunsmith now who can thread/cut a barrel for you.
Reply author: moke
Replied on: 03/07/2005 12:10:44 AM
Message:

Thanks for the information.The price of the action was inexpensive enough to warrent some cash being put into it.I have an old Leblond lathe that cuts only english threads.From what I have read most gun barrel threads were standard english form V threads.If barrel thread is "inch pattern".I can cut and fit a .45 or .50 blank on my lathe.I will buy and extra long one to allow for mistakes.My lathe and thread pitch gages are in a different state right now but will be home soon.
Reply author: Pettson
Replied on: 03/07/2005 09:09:38 AM
Message:

The modified m/1867-89 action might be a better option for you... It was updated in the metallurgy department and probably handles smokeless powder a little better. it even has sort of a gas escape, in case of leakage.
And since you seem to be missing a few parts, it might be cheaper altogether to get another action. Get an m/67-89 action for the project, and save the older action for an original restoration, as you find the parts...


Does you action still have the original rimfire breech block? If so you'd need to alter that too, or get a centerfire one.
The rotary extractor can be fitted to the m/67 action, but requires drilling and tapping of the receiver. The barrel is also differently slotted.

I agree with the previous poster that Kebco is probably the best place for parts and actions.

The barrel has an odd square (or flat, not sure what the correct nomenclature would be) thread, but it is not a difficult job to grind a bit to suitable shape.
Outside diameter of the thread is just under 1" if I remember correctly, and the pitch is 12 tpi.

A picture, for clarity;

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Pettson
Reply author: moke
Replied on: 03/07/2005 8:04:39 PM
Message:

Thanks for the great picture,as you say the threads are flat tip or acme type.Same type as M1 garand/Springfield 03.Were the 1867 model recievers reheat treated to handle the 8mm cartridge or were they newly made?Again I sound like a broken record but do you know if parts interchange between Remington's,Husqvarna's and Gustaf's?Mine does have the rimfire front block,is firing pin the same for CF and RF(different hole and angle I know) any more pictures would be appreciated.I know you guy's think I'm trying to "Bubbafy" this but I promise I will not.I don't think I will ever find an original barrel for this.I checked the imported listed above and they have nothing at this time.
Reply author: Fushigi Ojisan
Replied on: 03/07/2005 9:35:54 PM
Message:

Barrel-wise, it seems the one I found most-referenced in Internet Searches for accuracy and high-end application came from Badger Barrels of Wisconsin (www.badgerbarrelsinc.com). I am not sure sure if they updated their prices, but they do offer a 10% discount to FFL holders.
Keep in mind you have to do all the finishing work on a blank (threads, extractor cut, sight and band mounting etc).

Not sure if the parts are compatible with Remington, but I would bet they would be simply because Husqvarna was making them under license.

Ebay is a bit lame for parts, but I did see this barrel http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=71141&item=7140179392&rd=1
Reply author: Pettson
Replied on: 03/08/2005 2:55:55 PM
Message:

I agree, generally speaking I think most parts would be interchangeable, with the exception of breech block/firing pin/extractor alterations, as mentioned earlier. Expect some hand fitting to be required though.
Also, first year production (1867) had slightly larger diameter pivot bolts, so these 1867 bolts, hammers and breech blocks won't fit later rifles.

Adding some pictures again, hopefully showing some differencies between the breech blocks. If you want to convert a rimfire block to centerfire, you'd have to make a new firing pin, since the m/67-89 pin is a little longer due to the steeper angle through the breech block.

in the picture is an m/67-89 breech block to the left, an m/67 centerfire in the middle, and an m/67 rimfire to the right.
Note that the 89' isn't quite original; Bubba's been there with the power grinder, reshaping the grip a little bit...

Note also the slightly larger notch just above the pivot bolt hole in the m/89 block, to clear the rotating extractor.

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Pettson
Reply author: moke
Replied on: 03/09/2005 01:36:42 AM
Message:

Wow! Thanks for the great photographs.What is the small sear shaped piece on the m/67-89 breech block,is that the firing pin retractor?Loaded chamber indicator?It looks like in comes through the top of the hammer and pivots on the firing pin retainer.The GPC #26 catalog has hand drawn sketches of 5 different types.The lastest type on the main exploded view seems to show the firing pin retractor coming up through the bottom of the breech block and engaging the underside of the firing pin.I think I will try to find a later style breech block if possible to switch to centerfire and rotary extractor.
My action has the following markings on the right side,1872 date and a capital H above.I noticed in the other excellent photos at your web site that the royal crown is above the date of most examples you show.Mine has no crown,was this a civilian/export model or just a step left out in the interest of mass production?
I saw a Numrich Arms .45-70 "creedmore" style barrel on E-bay,buy it now for $110.00.I let slip through my fingers.Wondered about quality and why someone took it off.Would have made a great test gage for threading but aluminum is still semi cheap.I will take Fushigi's advice and buy a higher quality barrel from Badger or Shilen

If I can't find a breech block I will make a dummy firing pin out of 4140 and silver solder in place before locating and drilling new hole on mill.Does anyone still manufactor this 12.7 rimfire ammo in sweden? I have the same issue with a Winchester model 1890 in .22 WRF.Bubba's mom must have let him work in the front yard as your m/67-89 breech block looks good to me.Is that dykem on your m/67-89 breech block? Do all of these function in the same rifle?I will bore you with some photos when the project is underway.Thanks again for the info!
Reply author: Fushigi Ojisan
Replied on: 03/10/2005 10:11:00 PM
Message:

quote:Originally posted by moke


I saw a Numrich Arms .45-70 "creedmore" style barrel on E-bay,buy it now for $110.00.I let slip through my fingers.Wondered about quality and why someone took it off.Would have made a great test gage for threading but aluminum is still semi cheap.I will take Fushigi's advice and buy a higher quality barrel from Badger or Shilen



Funny you should mention Badger Barrels, I just found my invoice...

I had ordered a .45-70 Cal tapered Octagon barrel in Chrome Moly steel. I beleive I got it the longest length they made. The barrel was $243 ($270 - 10% FFL discount, and C&R counts) and $12 for shipping.

I strongly recommend calling them first to place your order that way, its a mom-and-pop operation that doesn't even take credit cards. Wait time is a few weeks.

They were really good at walking me through this. I wanted the best barrel available and Badger is it

Reply author: Pettson
Replied on: 03/11/2005 5:17:42 PM
Message:

Yes, that is the firing pin retractor you see to the left. These breech blocks should be interchangeable, as long as you get a receiver/pivot bolt/breech block combination that works together.

Military actions from HVA always have the year of manufacture and the manufacturer's "H" on the right side of the action, forend and stock. The "H" may be with or without the crown.
Left side of the action, forend and stock have inspector's markings and serial number.
The commercial rolling blocks usually have no year of manufacture or maker's mark on the right side. Instead, the barrel is stamped "Husqvarna Vapenfabrik" or "H". The barrel also usually carries the serial number (sometimes below the wood line). Alternately, the serial number is sometimes found on the left receiver wall.

No makers of rimfire ammo over here, that stuff is for collectors only... There are a couple of part time/hobbyist manufacturers of 12,7 centerfire though.

And that would be dykem on Bubba's breech block, since his mother not only let him work in the front yard, but also told him to put some checkering on that thing...


Fushigi, didn't Badger use to have a website? I had a link, but it is dead now. Haven't been able to find an alternate one either...

Pettson
Reply author: sbhva
Replied on: 03/12/2005 1:30:39 PM
Message:

Here is the link:

http://www.badgerbarrelsinc.com/

Hey guys, this is almost local for me. Can I help in anyway?
 
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