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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
A recent thread made me think of this post. Maybe later, a sticky? As most of us know. the edged weapon market (and all others) is being flooded with reproductions. Some have been around for decades. Most are very easy to spot. Some, only easy for the more advanced student. Some, on the other hand, are very difficult. The first rule is, if it looks too good to be true, it probably is. Rule number two, don't buy from dealers in China. Thought I would start with a couple, that have recently emerged on the scene. Copies of Chinese Nationalist daggers have shown up in the last few weeks. Just the other night, I saw my first Japanese Naval dagger. Both are pretty good. Especially the Chinese, cuz they're pretty cheesey anyway. Japanese NCO swords are rampant. They range from the crappiest crap, to some very convincing examples. I'll try to scratch up some photos. In closing, we need to stay away from posting detailed info, on how to spot the fakes. That can be done via PM, or email. The fakers are watching, always watching. They don't need any help from us.
 

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I think I've said in here before that ALL U.S. regulation swords of the Civil War period, both officer and enlisted models, have been reproduced as long as 10 - 20 years ago, most then in India and/or Pakestan. ( Not to mention various Confederate types! ) As in the warning above, most of these are fairly easy to spot, but serve as "canvas" for enterprising fakers to work with. Added to the problem is that these are by now acquiring some legitimate "age" on them. Caveat Emptor!
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Agreed James. Many of the Confederate swords that were copied in the 1950-60s, are almost impossible to tell. Especially now, that they have real patina. Some of them, sell for several hundred dollars, AS reproductions. Almost all Japanese military swords, are being faked. Bronze age weapons are also out there in abundance. I used to see lots of copies of Chinese bronze swords and daggers. Now it mostly Indo-Persian, and European varieties.
 

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Note that originally a lot of blades were made for re enactors as reproductions and not as fakes to fool people, unfortunaltey once on the market certain types of people will swear its grandads adn came out of the attic. The chinese stuff is strange as it is never sold as what it is a copy of, so somewhere there are actual versions of the 1866 with the modified hilt for the 71/84, 88, 98 rifles. There are a large number of Chinese blades I woudl love ot have but they never come onto the market
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Carl, I have to disagree, to a point. Many of the bayonets made in China, are misidentified, or mislabled. However, almost all of the swords are called what they represent. The fantasy stuff, can go both ways, and into outerspace.
 

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I wouldn't know about the swords, I don't do them, my comments are purely on the Bayonets, their 1866 Chassepot has all the signs of being a WWI ersatz, thats why i bought my first thought i had a winner despite the handling fees, greed lost me, of course it had a certificate of authenticity from a Chinese museum etc. and i was a little more naive
 

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It goes without saying that the absolute BEST protection against all this fakery is KNOWLEDGE: When I got interested in French Napoleonic pieces, I invested in a trip to Paris to go to the Musee de l'Armee to see EXACTLY what the originals look like, since information about them here in the U.S. is so poor. Nothing compares with actually handling and examining whatever objects you collect; as much as I agree with the constant recommendations on the Forum for various books, they still often leave out important details often only evident "in person". And photos alone often fail to convey the same impression as originals due to SCALE and other factors diffuclt to convey in mere photographs.

Understanding of appropriateness of manufacturing techniques is also vital; my sword-collecting "mentor" taught me a LOT about what to look for. A case in point ( that I don't think will help the fakers TOO much! ): ALL steel or iron scabbards produced prior to the Twentieth-century use of alluminum arc welding will have a more-or-less obvious BRASS SEAM where they have been rolled then BRAISED. ( Drags, throats, and carrying rings are also usually braised on. ) ALL Civil War-era and earlier swords have this; it goes for steel bayonet scabbards like on Chassepots too! On my Napoleonic-era M. de l'An XI sabre pour cavalrie legere it's VERY evident, wide and sloppy. If this seam and other braised features are totally missing on what's supposed to be a Nineteenth-century piece, IT'S A MODERN REPRO! Thankfully, the Chinese are using modern manufacturing methods; otherwise would oddly enough be cost-prohibitive.
 

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Hi,guys.I am from China and I am shame for the people who sell fake things on EBAY.I have to say the rule trenchwarfare give us is very effective,however there are also a lot of repro from other countrys and sellers may daze the buyers if it is not clear enough.The main point is to seller themself must improve there ablity of identify the repro.I have seen some fake Nationalist daggers in lacal forums last year,it is one of there new "product".If they have more new product,I will post the pictuses of them here.

Just like old-smithy said there are a large number of Chinese blades which are worth to collect,however these things are not so easy to available,even the collectors live there because the increasing number of collector.

Here are some of my friend's collections,we call it long Zhong Zheng and they are greatly worth to have one!

Dagger Blade Scabbard Knife Sword
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Thanks for posting. Very nice bayonets. You got Carl drooling now. I wasn't trying to single out Chinese dealers/mfgs. Fakes are being made in India, Pakistan, Malaysia, Eastern Europe, and Russia. Lots of fake WWI items are from France. It must be very hard, for a Chinese collector these days. I've owned quite a few Chinese military daggers and swords. No two are alike, and many were shabbily made anyway. So, faking is very easy. The worst part about the fakes being sold on ebay is, EBAY LET'S IT HAPPEN!!! I don't have a problem with an item being fake, as long as it's listed as such. But, most dealers call them original WWII, of some such. There are also some sellers in the US, reselling fake Japanese swords for big $$$. "Fresh from WWII USMC estate"!
 
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