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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
By request I am reposting the photos of my model 88 sporting carbine sold by the firm of J. Nowotny in Prague and probably made by the CG Haenel company.

The carbine started as an 8x57MM but is now in .35 Whelen. I believe, but cannot prove, that the carbine was bored out toa 9x57MM and then in this country rechambered to .35 Whelen. The bore has a land diameter of .351" and a groove diameter of .354". Though the land diameter is larger than my 1902 New Model Haenel the groove diamter is the same which leads me to believe that the barrel was rebored in Germany. I think that if the barrel was rebored in this country that it would have been cut to a .358" groove diameter.

Another possibility for this chamber is 9x63MM. I have made a chamber cast and fire formed .30-'06 brass in the chamber and found the shoulder position matches that of the .35 Whelen dimensions. My 1989 copy of "Wiederladen" by Dynamit Nobel lists cartridge and chamber dimensions for the 9x63 and shows the shoulder placement to be slighty higher than the .35 Whelen.

For loading I use .35 Whelen dies and Korean PS arsenal .30-'06 brass. I have a Corbin draw die that I use to reduce Hornady .358" diameter RNSP bullets down to .354". I have been using 250 grain bullets so far and even with mild loads the recoil is brutal as the carbine weighs in around 6.25 to 6.5 pounds. I plan to try some 200 grain bullets to help tame the recoil.

Vlad
 

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Thanks,
Both these and the 'New Model' (1909) sporters were imported into NYC, I'm curious about both styles.

I've also read good things about Hawk Precision Bullets.

9mm (.353, .354, & .356)

Round Tips
200 grains x .030 RT..........$35.00
250 grains x .030 RT..........$36.00
http://www.hawkbullets.com/Pricelist.htm
 

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Very interesting rifles and nice photos. Do the markings under the barrel indicate land and groove diameters of the barrel?
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 · (Edited)
Victor35, both your rifles are quite nice. i would be happy owning either or both myself. Are they both by Haenel? By appearance I would say so. Is the scope a Voightlander and Sohn?

Story, The 1902New Model has some extensive modifications to it. There is a five round staggared magazine, the firning pin is two piece so that the rifle cannot be fired with out the bolt head, there is a gas sheild like the model 98 Mauser and a few other small mods. I'll post photos of it in the near future.

The Hawk bullets are supposed to be quite good but to expensive for my budget as I usualy expend a minimum of 50 bullets working up loads. The Hornady RNSP run through a draw die work well for me and come out uniform in dimensions.

Jimmy C, Attached are some photos of the underwood markings on my carbine. The 172/28 indicates that the rifle is an 8MM. The crown over N is the German nitro powder proof. The NP over little p is the Austrian nitro powder proof. Below the Austrian nitro proof is the Austrian double headed eagle and below that is the Prague proof house mark.

Vlad
 

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Vlad, the scoped rifle is marked A. HACH on one side and BURGAN on the other. No markings on the scope. The other is a HAENAL. The barrels start out as octagonal at the receiver and become round at the muzzle. I am guessing these were never military because of that?
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
You are correct victor, your rifles where commercial sporters from the start, not converted military.

Vlad
 

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Dear Vlad, I am dragging on older thread out of the basement ;-). Maybe we can collect previous postings about '88 sporters here...

* * *

Vladymere
Posted - 09/23/2004 : 10:33:46 AM
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Fellows,
Can anyone recommend a source of information, books or internet or anything else, on the Haenel comercial sporting rifles built on the model 88 commission rifle action or the Haenel company in general?

Thanks, Vlad



jp
Posted - 09/29/2004 : 12:28:37 PM
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I have been hoping that some info would come forth also; I know of one for sale and have been waiting for a reasonable price. Beautiful rifle, I don't need one but the workmanship is hard to resist, double set triggers to boot! Plus I have a weakness for octagonal barrels...
....Anyone out there with info??? Haenel made some beautiful rifles, I have a System Aydt schuetzen and a falling block 22RF (KK Sport, I think) made by them.



John Wall
Posted - 09/29/2004 : 3:48:19 PM
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Vlad,
There are various Haenel Mod. 1888-based sporters pictured and described in the recently reprinted pre-WW I German sporting goods catalogs such as the 1911 Adolph ?? catalog. Have you seen these? (Can't rememeber the name...I'm at work away from my library, will get it this evening.)
Regards, John



PeterS
Posted - 09/29/2004 : 4:01:46 PM
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Hi John,
You mean the Alfa Catalogue (Alfa = Adolf Frank)



Vladymere
Posted - 09/30/2004 : 12:10:36 PM
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John, PeterS,
Thanks for the repsonses. I'm not familiar with these catalog reprints. Where would I find them? Amazon.com? Gunshowbook.com?



John Wall
Posted - 10/02/2004 : 12:19:04 PM
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Vlad,
Search bookfinder.com using this title: Arms of the World - 1911

This is the Adolph Frank "ALFA" catalog. No Mauser or Mannlicher collector should be without it. At the moment, bookfinder.com has three copies available ranging in price from $22.00 to 55.00. ABE.com and other sources may have it too. Pages 454, 455, and 460 depict Haenel type Commission 88 and Model 1909 rifles.

There is also a three page write-up in Olsen's "Mauser Bolt Rifles" (in the Sporting Rifles section) on Haenel 88's and Haenel Lorenz rifles on pages 260-262 in Chapter 8, "Mauser Sporters by Other Makers".
Good Luck!
Best Regards,
John



Vladymere
Posted - 10/02/2004 : 10:30:54 PM
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John, thank you very much. I'll get right on this.

I have also recently developed an addiction to the pre WWI model Mannlicher Schoenauer commercial sporting carbines. I just added a model 1908 to the 1903 and 1905 I have and need more information on them as well. Sounds like this catalog may fillthe ticket for this as well.

I didn't think to look in Olson's book

Vlad
 
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