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Discussion Starter #1
Here's a question for you latewar guys.

I have a dot 1944 five digit A block phosphate receiver. I do understand this is a 44 receiver that was completed well into 1945. I have most all the parts I need but I am trying to decide if I should give it a semi-Kriegs stock with bolt takedown disk, but no bayonet lug. I also have a very nice solid walnut standard cupped dot marked stock as well that I would love to put on it.

My main question is this: once the switch was made to Kriegsmodels w/o the bayonet lug, were all rifles like that? Or did they continue to issue some rifles with bayonet lugs? Also did dot uses olid stocks as late as 1945 or was that only in 1943?
 

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First off, I have yet to see a legit dot44 phosphate receiver- quite a few refinished ones though.

The stock should be semi-Kriegs as those are most common. I have seen just a scant few that were full Kriegsmodell configuration. Your 30000a suffix gun is about 15000 guns from the switchover to swp45.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Well it's a Russian capture, so I'm pretty sure it was legit. Found the phosphate under the Russian junk. The barrel is blued which makes it seem more legit as well. I understand dot did not phosphate many parts on their rifles; just the receiver and select bolt parts. I was lucky to find a drilled bolt and then some phosphated parts from charlie romero who does a lot of sales over gunbroker and auction arms.

Thank you for the info though, looks like I will be putting a semi-Kriegs stock on it. I'll put some pictures up here of it in a week or two when I get it completed.
 

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The barrel is blued which makes it seem more legit as well. I understand dot did not phosphate many parts on their rifles; just the receiver and select bolt parts.

I would say that makes it less likely to be legit. Barreled receivers were blued at the same time, there are not dual tone barrel/receiver guns. Dot is NOT known for phosphating receivers either, never heard that one before. The only instance where dot receivers are claimed to be phosphate is the 945 1941 coded G33/40's which were assembled post war. The receiver is not actually phosphate but bare metal-- the type of metal used gives the appearance of phosphate when left unfinished for 65 years. Late swp45 rifles have everything except barrel and receiver phosphated. Just going by observed legit examples I have handled myself-- perhaps one day a legit swp45 phosphate rifle will surface, but until that day.....
 

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Discussion Starter #6
mrfarb,

Well here is the rifle I purchased... What do you think? http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=76659704

The barrel doesn't appear to be phosphate, but it is a dot barrel with the shield/13 on it. I'm sure you are familiar with this seller on gunbroker. He seems to restore a lot of russian captures and resells them. So does this look like a legit phosphate receiver? Is it even phosphated at all? The phosphated bolt parts I have are just gray they don't have the rough texture this receiver has. But the phosphate on the receiver seems to have been done some time ago, not just recently... I just hope I didn't get screwed.
 

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I'll say this, these RC guns went through a refinish process-- if you look around, quite a few of them have rough finish to them. I think yours just looks like phosphate due to whatever they refinished it with. I will tell you swp45 started between 43,000a and 45,000a. Your dot44 was built in 45 originally with that late serial and would have been a semi-Kriegsmodell as built. BobinOhio has a nice dot44 that is very close in serial to yours. Originally, your rifle would have had a phosphate bolt assy. Here's a few pics of one of mine. Notice the dot44 barrels are very well polished, and my be the reason the RC blue looks more blue on there.
 

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Farb is a pretty good Late War guy....and I agree with his thoughts on your rifle. You didn't get screwed, just it is not what you thought it was. Your reciever has some roughness, that is unusual, but considering that some RC 98k's may have seen several rebuilds in soviet hands, it is hard to say exactly what has happened to it since 1945.
 

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It's refinished and/or refinished and worn.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
mrfarb,

Thank you for your help! It's fine for me if it's due to the Russians. I just didn't want to get conned by some bubba who thought he'd put his own phosphate on there and sell it. I like taking the crappy R/C and rebuilding them to their contemporary look. Whatever the Russians, Germans, Americans, Yugoslavs did to them is just part of their history I guess, so I try to keep that preserved if just subdued a little bit. So as long as John Boy kept his hacksaw and screw driver away from it, I'm happy.

BiO, thanks for the pictures, and I already have your CD :).
 
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