[DYNOMIKE]

ANY Help would be GREATLY APPRECIATED..
Since I don't know if posting a "LINK" to another forum is acceptable I will do my Best to recount a 3 YEAR Ongoing Issue/STRUGGLE I have been trying to figure out with a MOD-44 I bought (3 Years ago)....
I have requested assistance from memebrs of another Board (The FAL Files) and have received some Good Ideas, and attempts to help, BUT to date sadly NOTHING has resolved the issue....

What I have is a MOD-44 That SIMPLY Refuses to allow the BOLT to Close on a LOADED round when fed from the Magazine??
When the BOLT is REMOVED from the gun and a ROUND Snapped UNDER The extractor and Re-Inserted into the receiver from the rear Function is PERFECT. The Round Chambers, Fires, Extracts W/OUT a Hitch... NO Sticky Extraction, NO bent Rims. Nothing out of the ordinary.. Even accuracy is quite Good...

Some may question the effort put forth for an $80.00 rifle (I have as well) but I just hate to get my ARSE Kicked by something that shouldn't be that hard to figure out? PLUS I like the Gun it is a Pretty Nice example of a 44 and I sure would like for it to work...
AND I hat giving up, although I have been THIS CLOSE to TORCHING the Damn thing and using it for PARTS..

So Far I have Cleaned the Gun (Numerous Times) Checked and Scrubbed the Chamber as well (Even polished it) to no avail...
Bolts have been Swapped, Bolt Heads have been Swapped, Extractor has been Replaced, I even at ONE time thought FOR SURE I figured it out and removed a BURR in the Extractor Groove.. NUTHIN, but MORE of the same.. I have even swapped COMPLETE Magazine assemblies..
"SOMETHING" Seems to INTERFERE with the EXTRACTOR SNAPPING oved the rim the First THIRD of the way or so of the Bolt Cammng down and locking upinto battery....
This is a Portion of the info I posted on my other Thread..

"HOWEVER I did make an Observation/Discovery related to the Case Rims.
I was well aware of the COMBLOCK ammo having varying rim "THICKNESS" but I did NOT know how much the Rim "DIAMETER Varied?
I measured a Mess of rounds with my Calipers and found Diameters as Large as .068", and as Small as .060". Now 8 Thou "SHOULD" not matter in a Millitary action (I would think?) but I discovered this...
"IF" the RIM diameter is .0625" or LESS the Gun "WILL FUNCTION" Properly.
I redued the diameter of several case rims, and Culled a Couple more @ .062".
Loaded these rounds (5 in all) and proceded to Load and Extract all 5 W/Out issue? (I did this "OUTSIDE" in the Back, Muzzle pointed in the Dirt :wink

It DEFINITELY seems as though "SOMETHING" is NOT allowing the EXTRACTOR to snap around the Case rim? I am now Farley Confident that it is not Magazine related. The Cutoff and Mag follower seems to be working correctly.
Tonight I took the 91/30 and Watched "VERY" closely the Loading process.
Beginning with rounds "BELOW" the cutoff I manipulated the Bolt. A round came up into the Loading position and was then Pushed forward by the BOLT.
An "AUDIBLE SNAP" was present when I began to close the Bolt as the EXTRACTOR Snapped around the Rim.
THIS is where I beleive the Problem lies with the MOD-44? As this final Motion of the Extractor going Over the Rim (for whatever reason) is NOT happeneing with the Piece in question?
The ONLY thing I can see different from the 91/30 is the Extractor cut in the Mod-44. Although as large (top to bottom) the 44 "SEEMS" to have "SLIGHTLY" more Metal (thicker) from the Edge of the Chamber to the Base of the Cut-out."

I have MORE info I can post up but this is ALREADY a LONG post so I will START with what I have..
TIA....

 

[Frank]

Wow, it seems you have tried most of the common solutions. The problem may be that the cartridge is not lifting enough to fully engage the extractor. Have you relieved the wood where the interrupter (cut off) might bear against the stock. Some times when being restocked the wood is left to thick and the interrupter cannot fully move out of the way of the raising cartridge. Good luck !!

Frank

 

[keithreid]

have you compared the extractor with the one on your 91/30? see if it might be bent in towards the center of the bolt. also, look on the leading edge of the extractor. some will have a groove worn into them, causing them to hang up. one other thing to check is the extractor groove at the base of the barrel. if it still has cosmo/gunk in it, it won't allow the extractor to move like it should.

easy way to check the extractor is to take the bolt head off your 91/30 and put it on the m44 bolt. see if it'll cycle with another bolt head. if it does, you might have to take the extractor off and straighten it or possibly take a file and smooth the leading edge to remove a worn in groove.
or you might buy a new extractor and put it on.

hth, y'all have a good day! Keith

 

[sjohnson]

Sounds like a tight extractor cutout on the receiver - not enough metal removed, leading to limiting how far the extractor can spring "out" to snap over the rim.

Else, there's some hard cosmo or other foreign matter doing the same thing.

 

[DYNOMIKE]

Thanx for the replies so far Gents...

Keith~
Thought about that awhile back.. Swapped Bolts, Bolt Heads, and MAGS from 3 Other Guns.. Unfortunatly NO Help I'm afraid...

Frank~
I will check that when I get it Back.. Ya see I even sent this to a SMITH for him to check out.. He installed a NEW Extractor and checked some other stuff as well but I honestly can't expect him to dick around very long with type Rifle, although I am Quite appreciative of his attempts to Help me out with this Turd..

sjohnson~
In my Mind I keep going back to the SAME thought.. Although there is No Cosmo in there, the receiver dimensions could very well be the problem..
Question I have Though is this:
"IF" the Receiver/Machining is the ISSUE than this Rifle could NEVER have worked?
Although NOT impossible I guess, it sure does Seem IMPROBABLE?

 

[MilSurpFan]

I second that one sjohnson.

The key clues here are that no amount of parts swapping has helped. The other is that placing the rim under the extractor with the bolt out and then inserting the "loaded bolt" into the rifle works. That would tell me that there is enough clearance for the "loaded" extractor but not enough for the extractor claw to climb over the rim at the critical point of travel. To get over the rim takes another mm or two of clearance.

The hard part would be marking the offending area and removing material without damaging anything.

 

[hobbyguy]

I will be watching this one closely as I have a very nice rearsenaled Romanian M44 with the same issue. I believe it has to do with area on the face of the chamber that has been relieved for the extractor but as someone mentioned it is not easy to get to clean up that area and I wanted some guidence before trying. I have also wondered about the clocking of the extractor on the bolt as it looks to me on mine that the releif cut is just a little short towards the top to allow the extractor to enter that area without contact. The relief cut is very crude on mine also. I got tired of this one a few years ago so its been collecting dust mostly since.

I did notice some improvement with different types of ammo but found nothing that works without fail.

 

[stan741]

What kind of ammunition are you using?I have a bunch of Albanian that absolutely will not chamber in my M39 due to thick rims.

Stan

 

[MilSurpFan]

I'll restate my case. This is why it has to be a clearance problem either in the receiver ring just before the barrel or the extractor cutout.

"When the BOLT is REMOVED from the gun and a ROUND Snapped UNDER The extractor and Re-Inserted into the receiver from the rear Function is PERFECT. The Round Chambers, Fires, Extracts W/OUT a Hitch... NO Sticky Extraction, NO bent Rims."

Different ammo was tried
Different bolts (w/diff heads) were used
Even another magazine was installed.

Only the barrel and receiver are left.

If the extractor were removed entirely, I can all but guarantee that it will chamber just fine.

 

[7.62x54r]

Since it doesn't work anyway and all you have to lose is an extractor, you might try just filing down the leading edge of the extractor and the "back" side (away from the cartridge) to see if you can get any extra clearance. Also, since the relief cut may just not start soon enough, try knocking down the "left" corner of the extractor a little more.

 

[sjohnson]

Great idea Ted, must be my northern genes that kept me from thinking of that same fix and posting it

 

[DYNOMIKE]

I'll restate my case. This is why it has to be a clearance problem either in the receiver ring just before the barrel or the extractor cutout.

"When the BOLT is REMOVED from the gun and a ROUND Snapped UNDER The extractor and Re-Inserted into the receiver from the rear Function is PERFECT. The Round Chambers, Fires, Extracts W/OUT a Hitch... NO Sticky Extraction, NO bent Rims."

Different ammo was tried
Different bolts (w/diff heads) were used
Even another magazine was installed.

Only the barrel and receiver are left.

If the extractor were removed entirely, I can all but guarantee that it will chamber just fine.

It would certainly seem we are on the SAME Page, and as soon as I get the Gun Back I will remove the extractor and try this very thing.. You did indeed note my Attempts IE: Bolt's, Bolt Heads', MAG Swaps, and SEVERAL Types of AMMO were Tried..
In the Beginning of this Nightmare I did in fact try and tweek the Extractor with a Stone..
It seemed to HELP but NOT consistently that I coukd say it was FIXED.....
One of the replies to my Other thread suggests Bending the Extractor to releve some of the tension when it (The Extractor) snaps over the rim..
This may very well have a Positive effect as in His Particular Case his rifle did the EXACT same thing and responded VERY well to this "ADJUSTMENT"..

7.62x54r~
I wonder if a Combination of this and bending the Extractor some could Cure my Affliction?

I sure do appreciate ALL the replies so far, and I assure anyone interested will see ANY and ALL updates posted here..

 

[hobbyguy]

I will try filing mine down. Probably wont be untill next week.

 

[DYNOMIKE]

For those with any interest I Think I may have FINALLY figured it Out..
Won't know for sure untill I get to the Range BUT I have been able to Cycle about 30 Rounds through the Action using several different Types of Ammo including Steel and Brass cased. I did have to Give the Bolt a STIFF whack with the Palm of my Hand a Couple Times BUT It DID Close..
After a Couple Pepes Suggested TWEAKING the Extractor that is where I went First this time.. Although it Took SEVERAL Attempts I was able to Bent the Extractor (Much like one might do a .45 ACP) Untill I got the BOLT to close. I tweeked it untill I had Closing BUT NO Extraction and then went back the Other Way a Bit.. Each time I removed the Bolt Head and Extractor and made my Adjustment.
Hopefully I will get to the Range tomorrow to Test her Out.. IF I end up with a Signifcant Improvement I will be Pleased..
Will be sure to Ppst back with another Update After my Next Range Trip..