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Now, this one is not part of my recent haul... it is a result of it, though, as I got this one as part of a trade With Nigel, where he got that 1916 dated Mills bomb. Me and Nigel have started a New Project beside Our Living history lectures. We go around dressed as British soldiers and sing songs from the trenches. We Call ourselves "The Tommy Boys" So, no matter when this Jerkin was made it looks the part and that is the most important.

But, dating it... The buttons are recent additions, so they don't count. There is a label inside With the broad Arrow, but if there ever was a date stamp it has long since been worn away, no sign of ink at all to be seen. The model is one used in both world wars and further...

Now, the interesting thing about it is it must have been made at a time of great shortage of leather. They have not had large enough pieces to make the main panels of the jerkin in one piece, but have sown in asymetric strips/pieces to make them up. To me this suggests WWI shortage of materials, it looks very much like an "ersatz", anything goes if it Works, kind of job. On the back of it there are numerous patches, in the correct type and colour of leather, but several of them have been sown on With the inner lining in Place so the seams are visible inside. was the quality of the leather so bad that it was patched like this before being sent out, or was it repaired later, - i cannot tell. but, the patches are professionally sown on and as stated, correct type of leather With the correct colour, so definitely a military repair.

I know way too little about these jerkins, are there any tell tale signs, apart from stamps, that can tell what period it is? is it WWi or WWII? Looking forwards to hearing Your opinions, gents.
 

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Field Editor ~ GUNS Magazine, Co-Author ~ Serbian Army Weapons of Victory &PH - Kudu Safaris
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Sure look's like a WWI period example based on the patchwork nature of both the construction and repairs.

Gonna be hate-in BC in no time at this rate!?!?!? I'm guessing he's raided a Museum? HMMMM?????

OLGAAAAAAA!!!!!!!.......................CHECK THE DOORS!!!
 

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BC,


Unfortunately, its Second World War. The sewn in patch is very much post Great War. Also Buttons on WWI examples were attached via split rings yours looks like they have only ever been sewn on. Those buttons could actually be from WWI--Buttons were leather covered wood--usually smooth but the weave design is sometimes seen--see my Leather Jerkin.

Below are 2 of my Jerkins--The Leather one is manufacture stamped with a date of 1918 on the inside tail lining with a common wartime stamp of Number Over Arrow over letter code between buttonholes

The second is a jerkin made-out of Double twill which were only made 1916 thru 1919. The broad arrow acceptance stamp is in the same place--ink stamped. They tend to be around or even found on the inside leather part of the buttonhole.

The patch work leather is very common for any era.








Sorry it could not be better news

Take care,
Joe Sweeney
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
No Problem, Joe.

I would very much have liked for the Jerkin to have been WWI, but the important thing for me is that it looks the part when me and Nigel perform Our singing show. Had it been a WWI Jerkin I would have had qualms wearing and using it. Now, I will use it and it will look great, and I will not feel guilty of wearing out a near 100 year old wwI artefact. So, though I'd have liked another answer, it is still a good answer... Thanks.
 

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I will check my cellar and let you guys know :laugh:

BUT ... you spoke about "The Tommy Boys" ... I do not question the quality of your vocal cords but there is a song you should have on the 14-18 repertoire ... "When Irish eyes are smiling ...". I'm not Irish of course but remember my dad knew this song well. Dammit, he was in his early twenties (WWI) and in Ireland on leave. You know what? I'm glad to be amongst you folks and happy that my dad wasn't one of the saponified corpses that saw the sky on regular intervals and were dug under by each artillary event.
I have spoken with many of WWI buddies of my dad ... but I was too young ... they couldn't let me take a look of what they saw and lived. They had the decency to protect me (the youngsters) from reality. I can understand them but they made me miss the opportunity to make up my own mind in my early teens. So, I did this in my early twenties:).
More and more I realize that I (and my brother Jos) are becoming real "rari nantes in gurgite vasto". We have been educated by a father that lived through two WW's.
Let's be honest ... it wasn't always easy to get on the same level, humanly speaking.
 

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Hello Gents,

Thanks Joe! Learn something new everyday. Thank you for the input. I don't have a single source that includes this much detail regarding the leather jerkins and how and where they were marked.

Joe, do you have similar info regarding the U.S. issue leather jerkins? Over the years I've come across two examples, one with brass Belgian lion buttons and another that I have assumed was U.S. issue that has large composite buttons per the photo below.



It's a wonderful venue we have here for the dissemination of correct information that was never readily available until the advent of the internet. As I have continued to work on my novel I am humbled by the thought of the difficulty encountered by author's performing research in the pre-internet era before instant information was but a single search away........ WOW! :>O

Warmest regards,

John
 

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I will check my cellar and let you guys know :laugh:

... "When Irish eyes are smiling ...". I'm not Irish of course but remember my dad knew this song well.
Hello BC,

Speaking on behalf of the Irish who left for the States during the potato famine of the 1840s, this is indeed a favorite of the Irish from both sides of the Atlantic. However, within our Family, the tune "Danny Boy" was just a wee bit more popular around the house since our Father was Daniel Henry Sheehan III.

The Irish Regiments of the British Army along with the Irish Regiments in the AEF upheld a long tradition of the fighting spirit of the Irish. It also supports the old Irish saying regarding "The Irishman's War......which is better than no war at all!"

You'll have to produce a video of your next performance so that all of the rest of us can strive to match your vocal talents at the nearest Karaoke Bar we frequent.

Warmest regards,

John
 

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You'll have to produce a video of your next performance so that all of the rest of us can strive to match your vocal talents at the nearest Karaoke Bar we frequent.

Warmest regards,

John

These are wise words and an excellent idea! The one who collects artifacts of some 100 years ago should be able to present what realy lived amongst the youngsters in the mud of that time. If some Triple of Westmalle may be of aid ... no problemo ... you'll have it it in front of you when needed. What can we say more as: "Break a leg ... and let us hear those songs ... everyone will forgive some/a lot of false notes ... I would, because perfection is not of this/my world".:) BTW, I realy would like to see the face of Nigel whilst reading the above ... he is a friend and will always be.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
So you want video, do you, John...? Right, here you go... please note. This was recorded at Our very first performance, and we had only had time for two short and intensive rehearsals, so a few slips are to be expected. It was filmed in a badly lit room With a less than good mobile camera. But, the sound recording turned out well. It was recorded at a Scottish Burns Supper so we included the "Scottish soldier" well knowing that the melody is a lot older than WWI and the text a lot newer, but we needed a Scottish song for this occasion... So, off to the karaoke bar you go, John... ;)

And, Our NeXT gig is on the 9th of may, and we will have it filmed much better then. :)

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10202902891283329

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10202910782560606
 

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I understand Tore, but (as you know) I'm not impressed at all by the "Smoelenboek". Those who have some knowledge of Dutch will smile and understand.
Sorry to not be able to translate "Smoel" ... you folks may help me ... what is the most ugly word for "face" in English?
Not everyone knows me of course but let me put it like this ... It is I that choose to what I want to belong to ... It is not the ridiculous tryings of "mini habentes" that could change an educated mind. Forgive me, please, the use of the word "educated".
In short, I do not follow all what is proposed to me, let's say that I have the pretention to be able to think ... for my own/myself! May I recommend this to everyone?
 

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Hello Gents,

Thanks Joe! Learn something new everyday. Thank you for the input. I don't have a single source that includes this much detail regarding the leather jerkins and how and where they were marked.

Joe, do you have similar info regarding the U.S. issue leather jerkins? Over the years I've come across two examples, one with brass Belgian lion buttons and another that I have assumed was U.S. issue that has large composite buttons per the photo below.

View attachment 767890

It's a wonderful venue we have here for the dissemination of correct information that was never readily available until the advent of the internet. As I have continued to work on my novel I am humbled by the thought of the difficulty encountered by author's performing research in the pre-internet era before instant information was but a single search away........ WOW! :>O

Warmest regards,

John

John,

I don't have much info on US Jerkins other than saying they are like your photo.

I do a lot of original research of British Great War Unfirming, but rely on secondary sources.

I'm a contributing author to the French language Militaria Magazine and published a fairly in-depth article on British WWI Waterproof clothing items and I lumped Jerkins into that article.

http://militaria.histoireetcollections.com/en/publication/3107/militaria-336-july-2013.html

The majority of British Jerkins are as I said.

There was a type introduced specifically for North Russia which used wooden Toggles instead of Buttons.

The RFC also had a specific jerkin made and they might have used the composite buttons.

Take care,

Joe Sweeney
 

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Hello Joe,

Thank you for the details and for the info. How in the world did you end up writing for a French militaria magazine? Whatever the reason, we owe the French a debt of gratitude! You have been one of our resident experts and we greatly appreciate your contributions via your vast expertise in WWI militaria, particularly British and French.

Thank you again for your efforts on our behalf! Folks like you have added class to this Forum that helps to offset members like Gsu who have little of interest to offer the rest of us.

Warmest regards,

John
 

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DAMN!......Gsu must be driving around in his ambulance harvesting potatoes? It's not typical of Gsu to not respond to the peanut gallery!

;>)

Warmest regards,

John
 

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DAMN!......Gsu must be driving around in his ambulance harvesting potatoes? It's not typical of Gsu to not respond to the peanut gallery!

;>)

Warmest regards,


John
Sorry John, I have been working of a great comeback, but so far all I can come up with it "Oh yeah!" that and I have been busy driving my ambulance around, I put a couple of new tires on it this after noon and snuck away from the farm for a few minutes to play:)
 
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