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SWEDISH K
Posted - 11/14/2006 : 1:05:39 PM
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We have collectively decided that this topic is worthy of additional research. Thusly, please answer these questions within this message and we'll all learn some more, hopefully, about these C1900 marked m/96 rifles. This will be a permenent topic for the time being. Thank you.

- Gustaf or Oberndorf
- Date
- s/n
- wood matches receiver?
- which side of stock is C1900?
- bore disc, unit or other?
- disc inscription?
- other
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Edited by - Dutchman on 11/26/2006 8:45:05 PM



mauserdoc
Posted - 11/14/2006 : 1:34:21 PM
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Can you share more information on this stock? Pictures would be great. Are you referring to numbers inside the handguard and forarm of the stock? If it is imprinted on the outside of the stock, it is very unusual indeed. It would be unusual on the inside as well--is it possible that the serial number happens to be that? Will let one of the "big boys" have a crack at this one!



SWEDISH K
Posted - 11/14/2006 : 2:39:27 PM
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Sure!
Here is a picture.
It is NOT the serial number! I have seen 4 or 5 m/96 with this marking all have been 1900 or 1899 manufactured.

I do not own the rifle on the picture, so I can not take it apart and check the serial number inside the barrel tunnel.


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Edited by - SWEDISH K on 11/15/2006 3:07:07 PM



mauserdoc
Posted - 11/14/2006 : 3:30:22 PM
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The picture is very nice indeed--I think I have seen one of those like that before--Again, my betters will nodoubt have seen something like that. I have 50+ m96 rifles and have never had one with that marking. Don't know if it was a factory thing or not. Take care, Mauserdoc



swede
Posted - 11/14/2006 : 4:13:11 PM
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It is thought that rifles were taken out of military inventory & marked " C 1900 " for a particular rifle competition . Whether Civilian or Military competition is unknown at this time . Since someone posted one here that has a receiver dated after 1900 , the actual date of the competition is unknown . The marking is correct , not the work of Bubba . Perhaps more info will come to light in the future .

The examples that I have seen , were marked on the left side of the stock .



SWEDISH K
Posted - 11/14/2006 : 6:17:40 PM
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" It is thought that rifles were taken out of military inventory & marked " C 1900 " for a particular rifle competition "

Interesting, very interesting...
From where did you get that information?
Does/do he/they/you have any indications that support a particular competition theory? Which indications?
Do you remember which date the rifle had, that you mentioned was posted earlier?



Dutchman
Posted - 11/14/2006 : 6:56:25 PM
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The Carsten Schinke book published in Germany in the German language was the source.



swede
Posted - 11/14/2006 : 7:49:48 PM
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I cannot find the post that I refered to , but I believe it was a 1901 dated receiver with the " C 1900 " marked stock . I am almost sure the owner said the serial numbers matched on the stock & receiver , so we are not sure of the date of the match . It appears that 3 dated receivers ( 1899 , 1900 , 1901 ) are marked " C 1900 " . Maybe some other dates will surface later .



SWEDISH K
Posted - 11/14/2006 : 8:43:10 PM
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OK
Thanks for your opinions.
The pictured stock above is on a 1900 Oberndorf #48579.
The 1899 rifle I refered to was a 4 digit 1900 Oberndorf (remember that the first digit was a four), which I think of as a 1899 Carl Gustaf.

Hope this is of interest for you.



SWEDISH K
Posted - 11/15/2006 : 12:17:53 PM
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Found this (Gunbroker):


"Swedish Mauser Oberndorf A/N 1899,serial #29817 the only numbers that dont match are the buttplate and cleaning rod. Bright bore with good rifling, C1900 stamped in stock,normal stock dings for a military gun, no rust or pits anywhere. C&R OK."

Pictures gone since auction ended 4/25/2006...

Seller was bweese.

Seems like all known examples of C1900 marked stocks belongs to Oberndorf manufactured/marked rifles dated 1899 or 1900...

Have anybody seen a Carl Gustaf rifle with this stock marking?



Hag
Posted - 11/15/2006 : 4:48:10 PM
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Pictures of my 1900 Mauser receiver which replaced an 1898 Carl Gustaf receiver. The rifle has "C 1900" on the left side of the stock, and a disk with only the number "10" on it on the right side of the stock.

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I edited your statement to clarify the information , so there is no misunderstanding on the topic. Signed: Swede



SWEDISH K
Posted - 11/15/2006 : 7:40:45 PM
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Very nice pictures Hag!

Is it all matching?
Have you examined the inside of handguard and/or stock for serialnumbers?






parkerswede
Posted - 11/16/2006 : 11:53:55 AM
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The story I got about this was a national or international shooting competition in Sweden around the turn of the century. It was a sort of invitation only event with only the "big dogs" in shooting invited (either through qualifying in previous competitions, or titleholders, etc.). The stamp on the stock signified your participation in the event and was a real badge of honor. I was never able to verify it with any hard evidence or documentation, but it was relayed to me from a credible source. I have owned two rifles with such a stamp - both were early rifles dated 1900 and 1901 I believe (you know how that goes). I still have one with a personalized silver disk in place of the normal stock disk in which the gentleman won a Swedish national shooting competition in 1901.



Hag
Posted - 11/16/2006 : 12:28:58 PM
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Thank you, for the information. My rifle is outfitted with a Söderin Sight ,which is not on the rifle in the pictures. Going to shim the rear sight for long range. Were Söderin sights available in the year 1900. Did the two rifles you owned with the "C 1900" on the stocks have aperture sights. For major match shooting the Swedes must have used aperture sights.



parkerswede
Posted - 11/17/2006 : 1:13:06 PM
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The one I still have doesn't, the other one I don't think did either (but not entirely sure about that).



swede
Posted - 11/17/2006 : 2:59:50 PM
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Most of these " diopters " you are thinking of , came about in the 1940's & later . I suspect that the tang mounted " peep sights " were in use around 1900 , but there is no cutout in the stock for them . See the Kammarkarbin on pages 51/52 in " Crown Jewels " . So , that leads me to believe the standard military sights may have been used ??????? Any of the diopters like the Soderin , Elit , Pramm , etc. were added many years after the special 1900 match .



Hag
Posted - 11/17/2006 : 3:15:48 PM
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Thank you, Swede. I was hoping you would answer my question. After looking at the pictures of the Kammarkarbin aperture rear sight, I wonder how the shooter could establish a repeatable cheek weld. The sight is so tall it appears the shooter would have to hold his head up off the stock to see through the aperture,particularly if the sight was raised to the top for long distance shooting.



swede
Posted - 11/17/2006 : 3:38:36 PM
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Those Kammarkarbin carbines were for indoor gallery use only . I mentioned that as I recall something like a Creedmore sight well before 1900 that looked similar ( tang mounted peep ). I assume something similar was in use around 1900 , but I am no expert on that subject !

If you read the info in Crown Jewels on the diopters that you are refering to , you will see them dated in the 1950's , 1960's & 1970's .



SWEDISH K
Posted - 11/27/2006 : 05:58:30 AM
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- Oberndorf
- 1900
- 48579
- wood matches receiver? N/A
- C1900 on the right side
- No disc present



SWEDISH K
Posted - 12/01/2006 : 2:19:55 PM
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Oberndorf
1900
4873
wood matches receiver? N/A
C1900 on right side
No disc present

- other: This is actually a 1899 Carl Gustaf rifle with a new 1900 Oberndorf receiver, replaced for some reason...
The serial from the CG rifle was stamped into this replaced receiver by hand (1900 Oberndorf receivers without serialnumbers was delivered from the Mauserfactory as spareparts).



arilar
Posted - 12/01/2006 : 2:53:48 PM
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To clarify diopters on Swedish Mausers. As late as 1946 it was decided that diopters was for the first time to be allowed for national shooting matches in Sweden. This explains why Söderin, Pramm and so on started to be produced so late. What Swedish shooters were using at international free-rifles matches in Olympics and WorldChamps before 1946 is another story that I dont know about.



arilar
Posted - 12/03/2006 : 4:56:53 PM
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Will get my copy of Carsten Schinkes book in about 2 weeks and will study what is told on the subject. The first time Swedish shooters met m/96 was at "Riksskyttetävlingen" (The National Match) in Stockholm 1897. 2506 shooters in 15 different events during one week. One event was 600-meters shooting with the Mauser m/96 (otherwise the 6,5mm caliber was not allowed). The shooting was set up by the company "AB Svenska Krutfaktorierna" (Swedish powder factory) and they provided Mausers and ammunition for the 165 shooters that wanted to participate. During the week totaly 11 m/96 and 3 m/94 was given as prizes (silver-cups for winners and rifles-carbines down at the list).
1899 it was decided by goverment that 5000 mausers was to be reserved for FRS. Not allowed in competition before 1900. Rifle was to be sold to shooting-clubs and shooters by "Centralstyrelsen" (Central-board) that was head of the shooting-clubs at the time.
At the "Riksskyttetävlingen" 1900 ,in Stockholm, just 300 shooters participated because this year you had to qualify and 300 was maximum number of shooters (the Swedish King gave three m/96 at prizes). In 1901 is told that 2000 mausers is delivered to shooters in the country.
I am not so sure all 300 shooters in 1900 Riksskyttetävling actually had mausers, instead they might have used the old 1867 still. Maybe the C in "C 1900" mark stands for Centralstyrelsen and this is rifles sold under the year 1900? The Mauser costed max. 52 Swedish Crowns when sold by Centralstyrelsen. If ordered directly form Oberndorf the price was 120 Marks that I think was about the double price.So very if any shooters choosed that option.
1901 was the big event the "3:rd Scandinavian Shooting Festival" held in Copenhagen with 2870 shooters (191 Swedes and 129 Norwegians). There I think many of Swedish shooters used Mausers. The Danish shooters had the year 1901 dubbled the amount of shooters using the Danish 8mm m.1889 that had been introduced for the Danish Shooting Movement 1893. They were eager to present highest results possible at the "Scandinavian Festival"!
This winter I hope to be able to study the Swedish shooting-magazines during this period and will see what is written there.
BTW. PARKERSWEDE, if you are interested I can see if I can get info on the person on your "personalized silver disc 1901". Surely the shooter must be found somewhere if he won a mauser 96 that year!!



9638
Posted - 01/14/2007 : 05:57:09 AM
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I no longer have this rifle so I can't provide pic's but I do still have most info.

M96
1900 Oberndorf
Soderin rear sight
C1900 in side of stock opposite the bolt.
Regular front sight
No disc, just a round leather piece with a number (Don't remember #)
Serial number 54836
Mismatched bolt
Matching wood
Worn bore but still shot good
Sarco import stamp.

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Edited by - 9638 on 01/14/2007 06:02:02 AM
 
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