[Uncle Jaque]

Awlright, youse guyz;

Now ya gone and went and done it!

After all the rave reviews you've been posting in here about the CZ-82, you've finally worn your kindly old Yankee Uncle down to the point where I has finally done suscumbdicated to the overwhelmnifying temptation, and sent my order in to SOG this Morning. They've had my C&R on file for some time now.

What with the greenback going down like a house of cards against the Euro and about every other kind of currency in this planet lately (ya can only fund a war and a welfare state at the same time by printing more monopoly money for about so long) the price - or supply - isn't apt to get any better any time soon, I reckons.

I've done a passle of business with AIM over the years, and love 'em to within an inch of their corporate lives - but the difference in price and shipping between them and SOG was around $36, which definitely tipped the scales in SOGs favor. From what I've seen in here, they seem to have at least as good a reputation as any other C&R supplier.

Now I suppose that I can do unto the CZ-82 pretty much as I did with the CZ-52.

Some of you might be familiar with my "Shop Notes" postings in here on how I managed to figure out how to take down, maintain, fix, tweak, tune and reassemble the Czech-O-Matic largely by experiment, trial and (more often than not) error.

Eventually I was able to eke out a body of information that some shooters have found useful, apparently.

Perhaps I can do a similar work on the 82 - but it sure would help if I had some basic standard manual of some sort to start out with.
Any suggestions / links?

And as some of you might also know, I have a habit of inventing little tools, jigs, doodads and widgets to facilitate working on specific guns. No doubt I'll come up with a few for this pistol too.
Stay tuned.

Just don't expect anything conventional.

I ain't normal...

But you knew that already, didn't ya?

 

[Mak Maven]

I promise you will NOT be sorry.
Best gun in my little armory.
Carry only CZ 82 now.
EG Mak gets to play 2nd fiddle.

 

[Guest]

Some of you might be familiar with my "Shop Notes" postings in here on how I managed to figure out how to take down, maintain, fix, tweak, tune and reassemble the Czech-O-Matic largely by experiment, trial and (more often than not) error.

Eventually I was able to eke out a body of information that some shooters have found useful, apparently.

Perhaps I can do a similar work on the 82 - but it sure would help if I had some basic standard manual of some sort to start out with.
Any suggestions / links?

And as some of you might also know, I have a habit of inventing little tools, jigs, doodads and widgets to facilitate working on specific guns. No doubt I'll come up with a few for this pistol too.
Stay tuned.

Just don't expect anything conventional.

I hope you can 'invent' a tool or fixture to replace the slide stop spring when it falls out - Read over the following thread for a background on this weakness in the CZ82's design:

http://p201.ezboard.com/fczechpistols82792frm68.showMessage?topicID=485.topic

And here are some URLs that you might also appreciate having:
http://www.freeexistence.org/vz82.html
http://www.stevespages.com/ipb-czech-83.html
http://www.okiegunsmithshop.com/CZ_83.jpg

Ron

 

[Carguy714]

If you have a problem with that spring just PM, NORMSUTTON on this board and he'll make you a new one that replaces it! His are great and he'll walk you through the installation if need be. Great guy!

 

[Uncle Jaque]

Uncle Jaque; Meet Mr. Slide Stop Spring...

I have yet to meet Mr. CZ-82 Slide Stop Spring, but after we get acquainted, I'll see what we can come up with.

We understand that he has a certain reputation for recalcitrance and a stubborn reluctance to resume his station once he manages to escape from it, so our relationship might be interesting, at least at the outset.

If I don't manage to pop him loose in the course of flutzing around with the gutz of this little Czech popper (One of my mottoes; leave no complicated mechanism unflutzed with!) I might just intentionally do so in order to challenge my mechanical aptitude in seeing if I can actually manage to squidgle him back into his place. I almost called AIM and SOG to see if they had any bargain beaters or defunct returns that I could dissect just to see how they tick before I get my greasy paws on a perfectly good one. If any of you have a deceased, blown up or severely bummed out CZ-82 that you would be willing to part with for a reasonable price (or trade?) that I could desecrate in the course of self education, I would be open to negotiation.

Who knows; I might eventually be able to fix it.

Then again, as my Drill Sgt. in Basic once commented in a thick Georgia drawl;

"Clarkey; you could f(lutz) up a steeel bawll with a ruubber hammer!"

 

[Frenchy]

Uncle Jaque...I have the CZ-83 manual in PDF format. I could send it to you as a file attachment if you wish.

 

[Uncle Jaque]

Uncle Jaque...I have the CZ-83 manual in PDF format. I could send it to you as a file attachment if you wish.

Thanks!

PM aparently not being an option, try <[email protected]> .
Don't mind posting that one in public, as we have changed servers and it will be taken down in about 24 hours.

The 83 is essentially the same pistol, only in .32, isn't it?

That will be a big help!

Thanks again, Frenchy!

 

[Frenchy]

Thanks!

PM aparently not being an option, try <[email protected]> .
Don't mind posting that one in public, as we have changed servers and it will be taken down in about 24 hours.

The 83 is essentially the same pistol, only in .32, isn't it?

That will be a big help!

Thanks again, Frenchy!

On the way!

 

[wrangler5]

Uncle Jaque - as I understand it the CZ-83 is the "commercial" version of the CZ-82. The two are supposed to be identical EXCEPT for the slide stop spring mentioned above, and (usually) a square shape to the front of the trigger guard on an -83 compared to the rounded profile of an -82.

The -83 is available in 32 and 380, and in 9x18 Makarov on a less readily available basis (like, usually, special order only.)

BTW, if you or anybody else comes across a description for full disassembly and reassembly, would you please be kind enough to post it here? I have been looking for weeks without success. The manual Frenchy is forwarding probably only has field stripping instructions - that's all mine has. But I would like to find something that tells me what pin to take out next after I've field stripped the piece, and then what, and so on. As well as what sorts of surprises might await me in the disassembly and reassembly process, and any tips or tricks for both steps.

Thanks in advance.

 

[NORMSUTTON]

Uncle Jaque

Here's the link to the manual


http://www.czub.cz/navody/cz83_en.pdf


and I make the slide stop springs in two differant typs of pins ,one for the roll pin and one for the solid pin that has a slote in it

NORM

 

[shovel76]

IMHO,the CZ 82 is the best deal of the year.Have 3.2 from AIM and 1 from SOG.Got them when they first came out.Where else can you get a LN,all steel,compact,hi capacity,ambridexeios safety and mag release,2 mag pistol for $200 and it's a C&R!In the future,I see these going for $300-350!

 

[Uncle Jaque]

Aah So!

Thanx for that link - I've downloaded it and will print it out for future reference. I usually set up a 3-ring binder on all my guns, and that will likely be one of the first things that goes in to it.
At least the basic field stripping guide is a place to start from; I'll pick it up from there, and yes, if it works out well I'll try to post a cogent report here. Hopefully more organized than my attempt with the CZ-52.

One thing that I noticed right away is the similarity of the system to the Browning M-1911 design; the levers and buttons are pretty much in the same place and work in similar ways, and the firing pin is retained by a nearly identical system. It is even more familiar than the Tokarev, which has much more Browning in it's lineage than the CZ-52 which is, as many of us know, a very unique design that takes a little getting used to.

Perhaps one of the more distinctive features is the blowback as opposed to linked lockup system and takedown using the trigger bow - but anyone with a MAK will be familiar with that deal.

I have and like the TOK, but with those split end pins and spring-clip retaining forks, it can be a pain to even field strip.
This CZ certainly won't be any harder as near as I can see by the descriptions observed thus far.

Think I'm getting the basic gist of what that slide stop lever spring is all about, and the distinction between the older and newer versions.

Sometimes when I just can't get something to go together right, after I sleep on it a while, it often just sort of comes to me.

I'm going in to the Dentist in a couple of weeks for a crown, and for what we're paying for that, I would hope that he might be willing to clip me off a few inches of that stainless brace wire.
Do they have a particular size/dia. designation for it, or do you just ask by the decimal inch or mm?

I'm no master machinist by any means, but I have fabricated both leaf and wire springs in a pinch, and those don't look to be any problem at all for Uncle Jaques' Widget Works.

If I had one of those "ruined" pistols that have been mentioned here, I might even set to inventing a third incarnation of that spring.
Who knows; it might even work! (Occasionally one of my silly inventions does. Alas; I'm not getting rich on any of them.)

We're hoping that the LBT brings my 82 sometime next week; will keep ya posted.

Will probably start a new topic when that happens, and yet another when I start to generate a "Shop Notes" article. Per usual I'll combine photos and text with sketches as appropriate.

 

[NORMSUTTON]

Uncle Jaque

in dental stainless steel wire it's .028
I know because I'm a dental lab tec and its claps wire
and thats what I use

NORM

 

[Uncle Jaque]

Thanx!

Much obliged for the tip!

"Claps" wire, you say?

Sounds like something a Sailor can pick up on a 3-day pass if he's not careful!
Not sure I'd want to go sticking it in my mouth! =({8^{P~

Do you have to draw the temper in order to bend it, then re harden it to put the springiness back in - or can you just bend it cold?

 

[NORMSUTTON]

No Just Bend It TO Shape
Norm

 

[Uncle Jaque]

UJ Meets CZ-82 In Person!

I finally got to "meet" a CZ-82 today.

Having to run down town to do some shopping, I popped into the local hardware store where they have a small section dedicated to guns, ammo, accessories and such.
With my 82 on the way, I wanted to have some ammo all ready to go for it.

While I was waiting for the chap behind the counter to finish up whatever he was doing, I perused the pistol selections in the display case. There, lo and behold, were two CZ-82s with their distinctive ambidextrous holsters.

So when the Salesman got around to asking me if he could be of assistance, I asked to see one of them. This is the first time that I'm aware of that I have ever laid eyes on or touched one of these pistols.

My first impression was of it's chubby, yet ergonomically designed grip that seems out of proportion to the skinny, stubby little slide and barrel. It fills the hand well without being "blocky" as a lot of high-cap pistols can be. That puts the majority of the weight directly in the hand, and there is no perceptible "hang" sensation from the barrel, and the little pistol. Without the wrist strain of holding up a heavy barrel, it seemed that my arch of movement ("Shake") was diminished, and the ample (for a military pistol) sights could be held in alignment quite steadily.

The location and function of the controls on the CZ-82 are right where a pistol Shooter who is familiar, if not fond, of the Browning M1911 system would be looking for them and expecting them to operate.

This feature is most attractive, as my "Winter" carry piece is a Systema 27 .45 which I was packing at the time under a vest, having just switched back from my "Summer gun", a S&W Model 36
"Chief's Special" .38 Spl. revolver.

Not only will the 82 provide nearly as discrete carry potential as the snubby wheel gun, but it will increase my on-board cartridge capacity from 5 to 13 rounds - a pretty significant upgrade!

I won't have to re-acquaint myself with a totally different operating and loading system with the change of seasons, as I am currently accustomed to doing, either.
That's consistency, and a big factor in maintaining instinctive / automatic skill sets in a potential stress situation.

Does the CZ-82 have a "Decocker" function?
If so, is it reliable and safe to use - unlike the decocker on the CZ-52?

About the only "flaw" I noticed is that it was difficult for me to operate the magazine release with my thumb, as I am accustomed to doing with my .45. It seems that the thick front edge of the grip panel gets in the way. I can actually operate it better with my right index finger coming in from the other side and taking advantage of the "omnidexterous" feature.
Either way, I found it to be rather awkward.

Are these the original military issue grips, or replacement "sporting" grips put on to satisfy importation requirements? I know for a while anyway, Tokarevs had to be fitted with special import "Target Shooting" grips with that stupid "thumb rest" sticking out of the left panel in order to appease the letter of the dumb importation law. Sort of like those cobbled together "Safeties" they were required to have, too.

If these are "Import" grips, how might one get ahold of some originals?
On a "carry gun", function trumps cosmetic appearances, and in all likelihood I'll end up taking a file to that grip panel so that I can drop the mag one-handed as I am accustomed to doing with my Systema.
A section of bicycle inner tube will probably be stretched over the grip as well, providing better "traction" to the grip.

As for the ammo - the hardware store had have both Sellier & Beloit and "Blazer" aluminum cased Berdan primed rounds in stock. He'd had the S&B around for a while and was getting a little under $12 a box (50 rds) for those, while the more recently acquired Blazer was around $17.50.
Needless to say, I took two boxes of S&B. Perhaps I should have cleaned him out at that price - he had about 6 boxes left.

So thus far, having at least seen and briefly fondled a real "live" CZ-82, my impression is mostly favorable and I continue to anticipate the arrival of my own specimen so that we can continue to grow the relationship.

 

[wrangler5]

You'll like yours when it arrives, I'll bet. A couple of replies to your queries:

DECOCKER: There is no mechanical decocker, like many autoloaders have. But there is what feels like a very solid hammer block that is trigger activated. Unless the trigger is held fully to the rear, the hammer cannot travel far enough to reach the firing pin. I'm a right hander, and my method of decocking is left thumb over the firing pin, right thumb holding hammer securely, release hammer with trigger finger, ease hammer SLIGHTLY forward and then get finger off trigger. Now, as you ease the hammer forward, the trigger will move forward too, putting the hammer block in place. As long as your finger is off the trigger, no matter how fast the hammer falls (even if it slips out of your control) it will be blocked from hitting the firing pin.

It sounds more complicated than it is. In a pinch I would feel comfortable lowering the hammer without the left thumb in place - the key is getting the trigger finger out of the way as soon as the hammer is forward of the cocked position.

MAG RELEASE: I have the same problem trying to use my thumb to release the mag. But I've found that using the trigger finger has become almost intuitive in the month or so I've had my -82.

GRIPS The grips that come with the gun are "standard." One of mine was cracked, and I ordered a new set from CZ-USA. The ones for the CZ-83 are virtually identical in profile and outward appearance, although I had to use a Dremel tool to grind away a few of the cast bosses on the back to make them fit the -82. Apparently the openings on the sides of the grip frame are a bit different on the two guns so the newer grips don't fit the old guns perfectly without a bit of fitting. But there's no improvement in access to the mag release on the left side.

Before you take a file to your grips, though, look carefully at where they seem to be too "fat" and figure out why. I have the feeling that you cannot safely thin these grips in very many places without weakening them substantially, although I confess to not having done a particularly thorough examination yet. I sort of like the blocky feel - it's a "comfortable" bulk, as far as my hands are concerned, so I don't think I'll look for anything thinner. You might also look at the grips that Dennis Marschal makes. http://www.marschalgrips.com/ They don't look a lot thinner than the stock ones. (I have a set of Dennis' grips on one of my Makarovs, and they are truly delightful. Pretty, smooth, very slightly thinner than the stock plastic ones, and VERY reasonably priced.)

 

[The Mr Mitch]

You guys tickle me. Making this thing so complicated.
I've got it down pat.

I field strip and look at all the little goodies contained in the CZ82 or 52, make the comment that it sure looks complicated and then reassemble.

Now ain't that simple?

 

[Uncle Jaque]

It's HERE!!!

This afternoon while I was doodling away a rainy day reloading some 7.62mm NATO, "Domestic Management" alerted me to the arrival of the LBT.

I was beginning to wonder where my order from SOG was, but at length it actually did make the trip.

Back down in the basement "Labooratory" the box was opened, and within the scrunched up paper was a Czech "Pushmepullyou" holster that bore the tale of long years of hard use, but is still mostly intact.

Buttoned up within that was my little CZ-82.
A little holster worn to be sure, but otherwise seemingly intact, tight, and operative.

I can't get over how my hand just naturally wraps around that grip and locks on, as if it were some sort of magnetic attraction.
It's doesn't have that "bar of soap" feel that some hi-cap pistols have, but it seems to fill out my hand nigh on perfectly.

About the only flaw in that grip, to my opinon, is the superfluous ridge moulded into the left grip panel as some sort of "thumb rest".
About all it does is bar the thumb from reaching the magazine release button which, as a long time M 1911A1 fan, irks me to no end.

After I figured out that I had to draw the slide pretty much ALL the way back in order to remove it when the trigger guard is unlocked, a cursory examination of what innards as could be seen revealed that apparently no one ever "pickled" these pistols for long term storage as they did with the CZ-52s.

I could detect no sign of cosmoline anywhere.

Removing the left grip panel provided a better view of things;

If anything, the steel and parts looked quite dry, and before I put the '82 back together It got a good anointing of Ballistol.

Since I had that grip panel with the offending "thumb rest" off, it seemed like a good opportunity to do something about it.

Someone had opined that there would not be sufficient plastic underneath the surface of the grip to allow much trimming without going through, but after I checked out how thick that panel really is, concerns about that issue were abandoned.

First I backed up the undercut in the inside surface of the panel with a thin strip of wood in order to distribute the pressure of holding it in the vise evenly over the center of the panel rather than the edges.

...................

And a view from edge - on:

.........................

Then I got out the half-round file and began re-sculpting the contours of the thumb rest area:

When filing plastic, you need to card frequently.

If you don't know how to card your file, you probably should not be doing this!

When I had the contour the way I liked it, I went over it with some #220 automotive abrasive paper which gives it sort of a "Pachmeyer" look.

I like it so much I might rough up the other grip panel too.

When I am satisfied that the contour is just right, I'll probably finish it up a little more with some finer abrasive and then some #0000 steel wool.

The grip may well get one of my Mountain Bike inner tube grip adapters as well.
Simple, cheap, and they work!
I have them on one of my CZ-52s and a Tokarev:

.........................

After replacing the panel and replacing the slide assembly, the grip was much improved.
Although the mag release is still not as comfortable to activate as it is on the .45, it is a whole lot better than it was.

.................

The single action trigger on this thing leaves some to be desired;
it "stacks" a little, or is almost like a short double action because as the trigger is drawn back, the hammer comes back with it for a wee bit before sear release.
This makes for a long, draggy, and relatively hard pull.

After the trigger finally breaks, it falls back a fair amount before fetching up against the stop causing some deflection of aim about the same time the hammer is landing on the FP.

I don't know if anything can be done about that, and I'll probably just have to learn to live with it.

The double action pull, in my opinion, is better than the single.

With a little practice it can be "staged" up to the point just before let-off, then squeezed the rest of the way from there.

Since this pistol essentially uses the M1911 firing pin system, I don't suppose that some dry firing is going to hurt it.
If I want to really "break in" the trigger by repetitive cycling as we used to do with DA revolvers, I can always pull the FP out temporarily to prevent "mushrooming" of the FP head.

This sidearm appears to have been carried a lot more than it was fired, so some belated "breaking in" may well be in order.

I can't get over that "smoothbore" barrel; it looks just like a nice, shiny shotgun barrel.

Only when pointed at something that reflects light with a dark contrasting edge or line running about half way though the part seen through the bore can some "swirl" be seen in the reflections along the walls of the bore.

That is pretty neat.

I'm hoping that a test firing can be arranged sometime this weekend, despite soggy weather we've been having lately.

 

[wrangler5]

Your trigger sounds about like mine, although I wouldn't call mine exactly "draggy." And I had the same initial reaction that you did - the single action letoff is absolutely the softest of any gun I can remember shooting. BUT - take it to the range and put a few hundred rounds through it. If you can, set up multiple targets at close range and draw and engage each with multiple shots, first one double action. Then see what you think of the trigger. If you still don't like it, wait a week and go do it again.

I'm finding that I get more and better hits on these IDPA type drills using my -82 than I do with the Makarov I've been carrying and shooting for a couple of years. At the 50 yard steel plates I'm better with the Mak's crisper trigger (despite the tiny sights) but for closer in and quicker shooting, the CZ trigger does the job just fine, and the "real" sights help a lot too. I was surprised, but there it is. YMMV, of course.