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Need and ID on this Bayo please

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S

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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Here are some pictures of the bayonet. I have no idea what it is, it was given to me with no explanation. It looks an awefull lot like a Winchester 1895 bayonet, but maybe not long enough. Like I said I have not idea. Any help would be appreciated. I am guessing the sheath is not made for the bayonet, since it doesn't seem to fit very well (rattles around alot). Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks,








 
Len S

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#2 · (Edited)
Looks like a Romanian M1893, made at the Steyr factory in Austria. The frog is a WWII German model for the k98 bayonet ,the scabbard may be as well but might be for a Polish bayonet. Can you supply pics of the scabbard's frog stud and the ball finial at its end?

Best regards,
Len
 
Vaarok

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#3 ·
OEWG means Oesterreiches Waffenfabrik und Gesselschaft, or something similar but not mangled by my inability to spell. It's the full formal name of the Steyr works in Austria. Definitely not a Winchester bayo, and I'd concur with the guess it's a rather well-worn Romanian mannlicher bayonet.
 
S

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Here are a few pictures I snapped of the parts you asked about. To me it looks like a German stamp on the tip of the scabbard.

I haven't found much info on the Romanian bayonet. Where can I find more info? Are these very rare? What would you expect one in this condition to be worth?

What about the scabbard and frog? Value?

Thanks for the help.




 
vonmazur

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#5 ·
Looks like...

Guys: This looks like a Nazi scabbard on a Modell 1871/84 bayonet made by Steyr. They made bayonets for the Mod 1888 rifles that were sold and supplied to Germany.

Dale
 
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S

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
vonmazur said:
Guys: This looks like a Nazi scabbard on a Modell 1871/84 bayonet made by Steyr. They made bayonets for the Mod 1888 rifles that were sold and supplied to Germany.

Dale
Click to expand...
I think you are right about the 1871/84 ID. I did a search for that model and the pictures look about right. Mine is obviously missing the locking mechanicsm however. Are these bayonets desirable? I read on another post that these were the first knife type bayonets implemented for military use. Just regurgitating what someone else said, does that have any merit? What's it worth?



Thanks,
 
Len S

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#7 ·
Schutzen,Thanks for the additional pics. Yep definitely for the German K98 bayo. I thought the ball finial looked much rounder in the original pic and that would suggest a Polish piece. Dale I know Steyr made the rifles but I've never read anything that indicates they made the bayonets as well. Are there any fraktur inspection proofs on the piece?

Best regards,
Len
 
Vaarok

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#10 · (Edited)
Okay, the scabbard is definitely German K98 bayonet scabbard. Ignore that for now, it's ID'ed.

A Fraktur proof is a squiggly Gothic letter with a crown, a WW1 German inspection stamp. They're usually on the spine (top edge flat) of the blade. Look like one of these:


And found here:


As for locking mechanism, you're in luck. Turkish bayonets, which are cheap and common, were made out of all sorts of stuff, including lots of German war aid. You can probably find one of those heavily-modified Turkish-used German bayonets like yours and scavenge the button.
 
A

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#11 ·
Does not look like M1893. The muzzlering seems too large. Muzzlering on M1893 is only 14 mm.
If 17,5 mm it's made for export. Don't know the designation of rifle

Steyr did not manufacture 71/84 for the Germans. All German 71/84 were made by German firms

/Amsfelder
 
vonmazur

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#13 ·
Bayonet designation.....

Guys: The Prussians called the 71/84, and used it on the Gew 88 as well. The designation of the model did not change...Yes Steyr made the 71/84 bayonet for the Modell 88 rifles that they made under contract as part of the deal with the Germans on the Mannlicher Patents..

Dale
 
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marysdad

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#16 ·
Check the pommel carefully for a small bird figural. This would be the Romanian "phoenix," which would be consistent with the M1893 for the Mannlicher rifle.

The scabbard was made by the firm of Jetter & Scherrer. They were a manufacturer of surgical instruments, who also made bayonets during WW II. They are still in business today.

The marking on the frog is RBN, followed by a series of numbers. This is a manufacturer code used in the latter half of the war. RBN is an abbreviation for Reichsbetriebnummer (Imperial Business Number). I don't know whether the identity of any of the makers has been determined.
 
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A

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#18 ·
vonmazur said:
Guys: The Prussians called the 71/84, and used it on the Gew 88 as well. The designation of the model did not change...Yes Steyr made the 71/84 bayonet for the Modell 88 rifles that they made under contract as part of the deal with the Germans on the Mannlicher Patents..

Dale
Click to expand...
Dale

The Prussians, Saxons and the Würtenbergers did not used the 71/84 on the 88. On the 20th of November 1888 they reintroduced the longbladed SG 71 for the 88 in order to obtain additional reach, as the 88 was a bit shorter than the 71/84. Reach was compared to the reach of the French 1886 with bayonet.
The Bavarians however retained the 71/84 for the 88.

The Bavarian 71/84 were manufacture by V C Shilling, W K & C, Alex Coppel, C G Haenel, Soemmerda. A single Simson & Co has also been registered with Bavarian proof.

To my knowledge no Steyr 71/84 clone has ever been registered with any German proof or any German regimental mark.

Steyr is believed to have delivered 300.000 Gewehr 88 order by the Prussians (who used the SG 71)

German 71/84 produced from late 1888 and forward has a long fuller extending almost to the point. The Steyr clones all have a short fuller.

.........................................

Schutzen Meister

Is size of muzzlering 14 mm or 17,5 mm?

/Amsfelder
 
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