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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I was hoping someone could help ID this bayonet the muzzle ring is a massive .950 in diameter. I tried fitting it on a .69 cal barrel and it just rattled. At first I thought it was for a Plymouth but I don't think so their is also remnants on the blade which I believe is tin if so possible Naval use. I also think it's German made. The only markings are 2 letters on the blade near the cross-guard S&R.
 

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Looks like a French Yataghan sword bayonet for the 11mm 1866 Chassepot needle fire rifle. Should have more markings on blade. Also used on the 1874 Gras rifle. Widespread use by the French in their many colony's struggles and later the colonial armies they helped arm. Don't know anything about "tinned" navel use. Maybe one of the real "bayonuts" can give you a for sure answer.
 

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Both the French Chassepot M66 and the Gras M74 bayonets had a muzzlering of 17,5 mm.
This German made yathagan has a muzzlering of 23 mm

The bayonet is an export bayonet most likely for a Belgian produced export rifle. The bayonet is made by Schnitzler und Kirschbaum - their mark is S&K.

Comparing with a typically French produced M1842 yathagan, these German made export yathagans have a screw - instead of rivet - to fix the leafspring. The crossguard is squared in shape - most French are oval shaped. The fullers are different from the French fullers. On the German yathagan a squared block of the hilt brass is visible on the underside of the crossguard. Never seen on the French yathagans which were put together in a different way.

So far the pattern rifle has not been identified, neither who used it. Most probably the rifles were Belgian export rifles and maybe the rifles and bayonet were imported and used during the Civil War.

A rare bayonet :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 · (Edited)
After taking a better look it is S&K. This bayonet belongs to a friend of mine who has had it for many years he agreed to sell it to me under the condition that I could ID it. I think I have seen the S&K maker mark on South American edge weapons exports.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I went ahead and bought the bayonet owner still thinks it a German export for the USN Plymouth rifle made during the Civil War. He said the .69 cal Plymouth had a extra thick barrel. Enclosed is some very interesting info on the rifle and bayonet. One thing for sure the Plymouth and the bayonet are very rare. I sure would like to see if this bayonet fits on the reclusive Plymouth.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
This is what the seller thinks not what I think anyhow another bayonet collector thinks it's for a Portuguese rifle that was imported for the union. Anyhow lot's of opinions on this bayonet. The blade definitely had some kind of plating on it at one time which has some it remaining, seller thinks it's tin which was an early form of corrosive control. I appreciate all the reply's so far.
 

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Never say never, but Portuguese rifle imported for the union and tin as an early form of corrosive control.

Portugal at that time being a very poor agricultural country with almost no industrial capacity and for her own need importing arms and bayonets from Great Britain and other countries.
Browning is an early form of corrosive control, not applying a layer of tin.
Don't intend to be rude but it seems to me to be wild guessing based on no substantial evidence. If I am wrong I am all ears :)

Anyway.
Consensus about the S&K made 1842 clone is an export rifle - probably made by the Belgian trade. At lot of collectors would like to think it was imported during the Civil War, but so far no documentation as far as I know.

I have a S&K made 1842 clone my self. During the weekend I'll make pictures. It could be interesting to compare the markings of mine to the one you have

//Bo
 

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Hi Folks,
Visually, this bayonet looks very close to the French and Liege made Model 1842, even down to the 15 ribs on the handle. The fuller, however, terminates in a rounded point on each end, rather than a smoothly squared terminus in the photo I have. Here are he dimensions on the 1842 according to the book European Bayonets of the American Civil War
Overall Length: 27.4 inches
Blade Length: 22.6 inches
Muzzle Ring: .933
Accounting for wear and tear, the actual measurements on this bayonet may differ slightly and still be "in the ballpark" correct. I have not found information as to S&K making a clone of the 1842. I'd like to see what the measurements are for this bayonet.
Marv
 
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