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I have a 1891/30 Mosin Nagant. I have seen threads about people cutting down the barrel to make it even more accurate. I looked for the threads, but couldn't find them. Does anyone know the "good" length for them?? I asked in the Mosin forum, but all I am getting is sarcasm, no real answers.

Thanks
Russ

PS: here is the other thread
http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?t=78123
 

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I think the question is what are you using this rifle for? Going hunting? 22-24 inch,and that would be to make it handier to use.Too short,and you havent burned all the powder in the barrel,say 16inches.The Russians put scopes on those 28 inch long rifles,and gave the Germans hell with them.You wont ever make a target rifle from one ,but by hand loading with different bullet weights,powder charges you can find what it does best with out cutting it up.Best deal for a cheap accurate rifle,Savage 110,about 250 bucks.All you shots under a 25 cent piece.
 

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Are you perhaps confusing counterboring, with "cutting down"?

Counter boring will make your rifle more accurate, if the crown and or lands are worn at the muzzle.

Shortening a barrel for accuracy is almost an oxymoron. Longer barrels are inherently more accurate in M/Ns. That may be why you are getting static from some folks about cutting down the barrel for accuracy. It really does't make sense.

No short M/N has ever come near the accuracy of the M39s or 91/30s at long range from our experience.

I do have some very accurate M44s and 91/59s up to 400 yds. but after that its "iffy".

I'm sure someone will chime in and tell us how superbly accurtate their short carbine is at long range, but I would be skeptical, but there are exceptions to the rule. Also, accuracy has to be defined.
 

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If your rifle wont shoot close to a 3 inch group at 100 yards it may need either rebedding or counterboring.

Bedding problems are usually caused by worn out bolt holes, worn recoil lug recesses or warped forestocks. You want the action held firmly by the stock with no side or down pressure from the forestock, only a little upward pressure on the front of the barrel is acceptable and free floating the barrel as in the Finn 28/30 is best.

Counterboring is needed to correct poor accuracy if the rifling is worn off near the muzzle due to cleaning. Usually if there's even a little squiggle visible from the rifling at the muzzle crown it'll be OK. Completely worn smooth it needs counterboring:

I've never had a problem counterboring, even with my little chinese tabletop drill press. Just use a 3/8" top quality 45 deg. (standard) bit (NOT A CHEAP OR WORN OUT ONE!) at the proper speed (600 rpm if i recall correctly), set the barreled action up vertical and parallel to the drill and so the bit will swing out right over the bore center. Make sure the drill is fairly tight, minimal wobble. Use plenty of cutting fluid or motor oil to keep it cool, make short cuts under enough pressure to cut the bore continuously. if you're too cautious and let it rub instead of cutting it'll just get hot. Pull the bit out and inspect for good rifling around the cut. When you hit decent rifling you're done. Knock any chips off with a piece of brass or plastic.
I've never had a problem centering either because the 45 deg. drill bit really wants to go right down the center of the bore or maybe because I'm so anal retentive I get it perfectly centered and straight. I've always gotten back within 3 moa - about 3 inches at 100 yards.
 

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I think the question is what are you using this rifle for? Going hunting? 22-24 inch,and that would be to make it handier to use.Too short,and you havent burned all the powder in the barrel,say 16inches.The Russians put scopes on those 28 inch long rifles,and gave the Germans hell with them.You wont ever make a target rifle from one ,but by hand loading with different bullet weights,powder charges you can find what it does best with out cutting it up.Best deal for a cheap accurate rifle,Savage 110,about 250 bucks.All you shots under a 25 cent piece.

Completely OT, I don't see the Savage 110 on their website anymore...can you still get a plain 110? And at 250 bucks, are you referring to an accutrigger version, or an older 'plain' one?

A friend and I have been debating Remington 700 vs Savage, thinking of getting one in .308 and setting it up as a 'tactical' system. If we could find a 110 in .308 for around 250 bucks...lets just say the debate would be over :D
 

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I got a Weatherby Vanguard in 300 Wby Magnum for under $350 - BRAND NEW.
Of course factory ammo is $2 a round but I reload and it costs little more than .30-06 that way. 7mm mag Weatherbys were the same price at Walmart on clearance of old stock if you want cheaper shooting and a less sore shoulder.
The Vanguard (Howa) is a very standard mauser type without the 3rd lug - fully adjustable trigger, no corners cut, all forging and machining.
The 300 Weatherby Mag really reaches out and touches someone - none of that wimpy .308 bullet drop!
I put a Nikon Team Primos scope on it - ultra bright Golden Monarch optics, unobtrusive BDC, on Burris signature rings and mounts - easily does 1 MOA with no tuning of loads needed so far.
This rifle has made me swear off even thinking of more sporterizing of milsurps.
 

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dorklord, I checked the Savage site,and your right the 110 that was the staple of big 5 sporting ,dunhams etc isnt there.looks like they have turned it in to the 114 ,or a more high end rifle.They made 110"s for 40 years so they turn up used,just have to walk the gunshows.2-3 years back at the range a guy had one,and he knew just enough about shooting to be safe,and he was clover leafing his targets in between asking how to adjust the scope,sling etc.
 

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Sometimes the lands at the front end of the barrel gets nicked up for what ever reason. A good fast way to solve this problem is to hack of the first half inch or so and recrown the barrel..This will restore accuracy from the problem the barrel had.. You should already know that a lot of Mosin Nagants are being sold with the first inch or two being drill out from the front of the barrel. This sometimes will help but not the correct way to correct the problem
 

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Counterboring is the way the Russian arsenal fixed the problem.

"Correct" way is a real can of worms. It may be better to say, IMO the "best" way to fix accuracy problems from worn lands near the muzzle is to cut off part of the barrel.

Actually IMO either is not an option, if a accurate rifle is needed. I would just buy one with a new or near new barrel. They are only $69 folks.

However, if someone has one that happens to have a worn crown or bad lands at the muzzle and wants to keep the particular rifle. It is an easy fix to crown or counterbore if needed.

In most cases, it is just not cost productive to put a lot of work into rifles that are less than $100.

I have never seen a M/N with a barrel cut short by an inch or two.

One thing to consider if anyone is thinking about cutting a few inches off a barrel.

The front sights will have to be re installed. BIG HASSLE. As well ast the wood may not fit right.

To each his own, but understand what you are getting into.

Counterboring and sometimes just recrowning will fix the accuracy issues.

Both can be done in a heartbeat as compared to cutting off some of the barrel.

I still think the "cutting down the barrel for accuracy" bit is missunderstood by the original poster.
 

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to BigShot - i am not shure where a sweet spot on a mosin barrel would be. the above posts give excellent info on free floating, counter boring, bedding, and i have read of other forum members achieving 1-2 moa accuracy with mosin carbines and long rifles. i have a T53 bring back (complete with worm holed stock) which i never shoot. but i also have a slightly modified M44 which i use as a hunting rifle and as such, is modified to suit my requirements. it has a 16.5", free floated barrel, the action has been massaged to be smooth and quick, clean 4# trigger pull, magazine capacity increased to hold 5 rounds and allows bolt to be closed on an empty chamber (the safest way to carry in the field), modified front site post (adjustable for height and windage), modified rear sight full adjustable for height and windage, weighs about 8# field ready with full mag and sling. this rifle is my constant hunting companion in the thick maine woods where i seldom get a shot greater than 125yds, most in the 50-75yd range. it is short, reliable and fast handling. and with 180gr soft point ammo, more than enough power for my needs. with my over 60 eyes it shoots 1-2moa off a rest. i have other milsurps that are and will remain un-altered, but this mosin is also a hunting tool and it performs very well for me. over the winter i plan on pillar bedding the action. some of the recommendations of other forum members offer less radical methodes to improve mosin accuracy without taking away any of the historical essence of these fine rifles. best, john
 
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