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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Materials of the stock of T38 on Manual

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Topic author: j hawk
Subject: Materials of the stock of T38 on Manual
Posted on: 09/02/2004 03:21:21 AM
Message:

I have never seen any manuals of T-38 rifle until now.
But, I finally obtained ORIGINAL manual book of T-38.

The right column says: gJuly 9 , Showa 4h, which means July 9, 1929.
The middle column says gReleased for publication by The Department of the Armyh.
The left column says "How to handle the Type-38 Infantry Rifle and Carbine".
The size is 10.8cm X 7.6 cm (4.32in X 3.04in).
All 57 pages, and 4 folded drawings.

There is an interesting@description of this manual book on 22 pages.
It is about the materials of the stock.
It is written that the materials of the stock of T38 rifles makes with a walnut("Kurumi"(oni-gurumi) ) ,beech("Buna"),Japanese Judas tree("Katsura", scientific name:Cercidiphyllum japonicum) .

Thanks
* This manual is not for sell.




Replies:

Reply author: Vulch
Replied on: 09/02/2004 05:22:39 AM
Message:
Hmmmm. Interesting!

I have one T38 Carbine in Walnut, one T38 rifle in beech, and all my T99's must therefore be Judas (assumng they kept using the same woods)

Reply author: Vulch
Replied on: 09/02/2004 05:26:09 AM
Message:
Looking it up, we find a Judas tree wood description: Wood - light, soft, not strong, fine grained. It is a highly valued timber and is used for furniture, the interior finishes of buildings, boxes etc

Yep, sounds like THAT wood no one identified before so prevalent on T99's!

Reply author: Ronin48
Replied on: 09/02/2004 08:58:28 AM
Message:
Some years bck one of the members sent a chunk of 38 stock to a U.S. forestry lab for identifiction. Answer was it "resembled" an oriental butternut. Once knew what this was, but 'disremember.'

Reply author: Francis C. Allan
Replied on: 09/02/2004 4:35:25 PM
Message:
I have a copy of the same manual, but I am missing two pages 30 & 31. Any chance I can get you to send me copies of those two pages?

The front cover functionally translates to "Type 38 Infantry Rifle and Cavalry Carbine Instruction Manual", "Censored by the Ministry of the Army" and "July 9, 1929" as you noted.

What condition are your fold out pages in?

Frank

Reply author: j hawk
Replied on: 09/02/2004 7:22:35 PM
Message:
Thank you all for the reply.

Mr.Francis C. Allan,
Thank you for the correct english translation as the front cover.
I follow your the indication.

Page 30/31 are pages of the simply explanation of the usage of the attachments(muzzle cover,cleaning rod, sling.....etc.).
The pages in folded 4 drawing is very good(no stain,no crack).

I will send you the photo-copy on the pages(P 30/31).
Please email me.

Thanks

Reply author: christian rifle
Replied on: 09/02/2004 9:03:15 PM
Message:
Now we know.
Awsome!

Reply author: garfield
Replied on: 09/03/2004 02:18:50 AM
Message:
jayhawk:

thank you for the information. A very interesting and desirable acquisition.

Good Hunting,

Reply author: car99
Replied on: 09/03/2004 02:24:01 AM
Message:
j hawk, thanks much for the info on the woods they used.

Reply author: arisakadogs
Replied on: 09/03/2004 09:08:14 AM
Message:
jhawk, this is very interesting and very welcome information! I'm sure we've all been wondering about this subject for some time. Thank you for sharing!
I can't help but wonder now, how common is walnut in Japan & how does it differ from the walnut we're used to here? European walnut is lighter in weight and is lighter in color than domestic walnut.
I have two 4th series T-99s that appear to have the beech wood stock. It has the flecks in the grain just like the Tokyo T-14 grip panels.
The late substitute T-99s appear to have another type of wood. I've heard some suggest that it might be cherry. It seems to be more brittle than the earlier woods used - I suspect this may account for the larger recoil bar nuts.
Anyway, this is some stuff I've been wanting to know for some time. I hope more information comes out!

Reply author: j hawk
Replied on: 09/04/2004 06:50:59 AM
Message:
I made up table about the material of the stock of T-30, T-38, and T-99.
3 photos under the table is a page of the descriptions of the material of the
stock of each rifle in manuals.
This table is information only from the manual books.

About the description of the material of the stock in manual of T-30 Rifle:
The kanji characters that means beech, but Katakana characters alongside Kanji characters means fir tree.(red arrow on the photo). Which is correct???
Was it true though only the walnut was written in T99 manual??

Thanks
I am sorry my poor English.


Reply author: Don Blosser
Replied on: 09/04/2004 07:45:38 AM
Message:
My T30 is definitely a beech stock. I recall being told that all of the earlier Japanese rifles such as the Muratas were stocked in imported European walnut. Is beech a native tree to Japan?

Reply author: fredh
Replied on: 09/04/2004 09:19:52 AM
Message:
J Hawk, I used one of my 1930's Japanese/American dictionaries to translate the identifications. Kurumi translates hickory or walnut (they're in the same family), and buna (beech). There is listed momi (spruce), and katsuyoju (broad leaf tree). That's as close as I can get with the last 2. I've been doing this in haste and will check my input later. We're in the middle of a hurricane and are having power fluctuations. Your translations look good to me!

Reply author: ncmtnman
Replied on: 09/23/2004 11:22:34 AM
Message:
I was wondering--are there re-prints of this manual available? There may be others that would like to have a copy.

Reply author: szeigler
Replied on: 09/23/2004 2:18:14 PM
Message:
I've got a photocopy(s) of the Type 99 Rifle Manual. If you want one, it's yours for $7.00 shipped USPS, CONUS. I've got five or six left over from the Blevin's Shootout.

Email me for contact info.

Shannon

Reply author: Stan Zielinski
Replied on: 09/27/2004 09:13:57 AM
Message:
I do not have all of my wood reference books at hand but here are a few quotes from “The Complete Encyclopedia of Wood” by Thomas Corkhill. First only the scientific Latin wood names are precise. Common names are often badly misused for a variety of reasons. For example, nearly 100 different species of wood are referred to as “ironwood” (page 264); over 60 different species are referred to as “mahogany” (page 321) and the term “walnut” is almost equally misused (page 625). The walnut that grows in Europe has the scientific name Juglans Regia; the walnut that grows in the US is Juglans Nigra; the walnut that grows in Japan is Juglans Sieboldiana; and the walnut that grows in northeast China is Juglans Mandschurica. (page 625) Corkhill gives “kurumi” as the Japanese for Juglans Sieboldiana (page 625) and gives this description of Juglans Mandschurica: “Resembles Juglans Regia but lighter, milder, not so variegated, and with straighter grain.” (page 625) My own opinion is that most of the walnut used for rifle stocks was imported from China. (See the book “Forestry in Communist China.”)
I have seen several Model 99 stocks made of beech and when I patched one forearm with a piece of American beech the patch and original stock looked pretty much the same. If you’re familiar with American beech, you know the appearance distinguishes it quite clearly from other woods. The family name for beech is Fagus and there are a number of different species. (page 35)
Hickory also has a number of species in the family Carya and so is totally unrelated to a “true” walnut. (page 244) I have never seen a Japanese stock made of hickory.
The other wood I have seen used for Model 99 stocks is a wood which resembles American soft maple (family name Acer).
If j_hawk is willing I’ll see if I can use a scientific dictionary to translate the Japanese names into scientific names, and, since this is an area of long standing interest, put together a more detailed article on this topic for BANZAI.



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