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Well, after saving my pennies and getting an M39, i finally got to the range to try our various ammo. All i can say is that the rifle is precise, but not accurate.

In the picture you can see where the rounds went. In case you're curious, H is Bugarian heavy, B is Bulgarian light, C is Chinese, and 7 is 7N1 sniper. Five rounds each, 19 holes in the paper (missed one Bugarian light) at 100 yards. My aim point was the bottom edge of the target.

This is pretty disappointing. While the rifle is precise enough (i'm not a very good shot) it shoots 10 inches too high. So it is not accurate.

Since the sight is marked for 150 meters, i thought i'd put a target at 200 yards to see how it goes. Never hit paper once. I think the bullets are still going up and over the target at 200 yards.

Does anybody know of a way to "lower" the sight? To hit the bullseye i'd have to shoot 4 inches below the target at 100 yards and around 8 inches below at 200 yards. Shooting further is out of the question.

Any advice? My current review of a Finn is "good," but doesn't have the accuracy of a cheap Russian MN.
 

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I understand - Some of my Finn rifles have ho hum accuracy - Some will literally shoot a fly off a bulls ass at a hundred. Each rifle has a preference for ammo(as you most likely know) The trick is to search and find the right ammo that will shoot well in your M39, that may mean reloads... - Of course any rifle with a worn bore will shoot poorly - Other factors include tightening the action screws(My 28-30 shot poorly with a worn bore....I tightened up the loose action screws & the 4 inch group at a hundred shrunk by 50%) - Properly bedded action - The trigger - Shimming the barrel - and the shooter....;)(I have a friend who can't shoot worth beans....:( )

This Tikka M39 is one of my most accurate MN's with Albanian ammo......

Pahtu.
 

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That phenomena is incredibly common with all WWII surplus rifle. Most of my Soviet 91/30s shoot over a foot high.

Your M39 just needs to be sighted in. There's nothing wrong with it.

The correct answer is a taller front sight.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
This was my sighting in. The rear sight was at the closest setting and the front sight doesn't go up or down.

So the front sight needs to be taller? OK.

Where does one find a replacement sight? How do you determine the height of the sight (when ordering)?

How do you calculate how much taller the sight needs to be?
I'd hate to buy and replace the sight only to find that the group dropped from 10 inches to high to 5 inches to high and i have to buy another one.

Sorry for all the questions, bu i'm pretty new at all this.
 

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That phenomena is incredibly common with all WWII surplus rifle. Most of my Soviet 91/30s shoot over a foot high.

Your M39 just needs to be sighted in. There's nothing wrong with it.

The correct answer is a taller front sight.

I agree, it doesnt matter where the points of impact are , what matters is the grouping! From the looks of it its doing great. With a scope your rifle may create "clover leafs" you just cant tell what a rifle can really do with open sites and human eyes at 100 yards.
 

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So the front sight needs to be taller? OK.

Where does one find a replacement sight? How do you determine the height of the sight (when ordering)?

How do you calculate how much taller the sight needs to be?
I'd hate to buy and replace the sight only to find that the group dropped from 10 inches to high to 5 inches to high and i have to buy another one.

Sorry for all the questions, bu i'm pretty new at all this.
On my B-brl. M-39 there is a very faint "75" on the top of the front sight blade. This means "7,5mm" high. Take a look at your front sight, and see what it looks like. As for replacements, try Tennessee Gun, they have a higher front sight for M39 rifles. I dimly recall it is like 9mm or something. As for shooting, try tightening all of your screws after you reassemble the rifle. Shoot slowly, and try just one kind of ammo for a bit before changing the type of ammo. I will say that the upper left group marked "H" looks pretty darn accurate to me! Now to get that group closer to the bulls-eye. Many Soviet M91/30 and M1944 rifles have similar issues. Right now I've got an ex-Dragoon that is way over to the right. I'm going to try my hand at shimming the metal to stock fit, perhaps fix the bayonet, and see if that helps. I'll also try out some heavy ball to see if that diet works. Keep at it, and you'll get the rifle and load figgered out.
 

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Easy adjustment of the front sight is to take a plastic q-tip, the kind that are hollow and drill it so that it fits over your front sight. Then cut it to the right length. Paint it white, black or whatever collor you want and you have the right hieghth front sight. Don't worry if you get it wrong, you will have a bunch in the box to experiment with.
 

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Easy adjustment of the front sight is to take a plastic q-tip, the kind that are hollow and drill it so that it fits over your front sight. Then cut it to the right length. Paint it white, black or whatever collor you want and you have the right hieghth front sight. Don't worry if you get it wrong, you will have a bunch in the box to experiment with.
That would work on a Russian sight, but not an M-39, which is a blade sight.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Thanks all for the advice.

Tennessee Gun Parts has 9mm sights for sale. Mine is marked 7mm, so this should work well. Did a little more searching and found that sight replacement on an m39 is very easy. Even i can do it!

Once replaced and sighted in, i'll post the awesome results.;)
 

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Pretty dang good groups really. Those three Heavy Bulgarian shots are tight. Looks like about three inch groups on average, and that is acceptable military accuracy. I don't know if you shot off bags, or what, but I'd call that a good day. Get that higher front sight.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Yes, this was shot off bags. I can't hit much standing:eek:!

I'm quite pleased with the grouping; no problem there. My issue was that to hit the center of the target, i'd have to aim at a point about 4 inches below the paper. Without something to line up my sights, i can't hit anything. And at 200 yards, i never hit paper.

I think the tall sight will solve my biggest problem.
 

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According to 7.62x54r's site, the sight radius of the M39 is 22.75", which will place the target at 100 yards approx. 3624" from the rear sight (assumes that the muzzle of the rifle is pretty close to being exactly at the zero line) so the ratio of difference in elevation of POA and POI (10") and the distance from rear sight to target (3624") is approx. 0.00275938189845475 (10 / 3624 = 00.00275938189845475). Multipy the distance from the rear sight to the front sight (22.75") by this ratio (0.00275938189845475) and you get the difference in inches that the front sight needs to be raised so that it would have been pointing to the point of impact instead of 10" too low. 22.75 * 0.00275938189845475 = 0.0627759381898455 So, you need a front sight blade approx. 0.06" taller. Multiply that by 25.4 to get the answer in millimeters = approx. 1.6mm, so if your current sight is marked 7.5 like daveccarlson mentioned then one that is 9.1 would be about right.

To turn the equation backwards, a front sight blade which was 1.5mm higher (9.0 marked) would result in your POI dropping approx. 9.4 inches.

But the tall sights at Tennesee Gun (see link below) are actually 9.5mm in height, so if you started with a 7.5 and went to a 9.5 you would be dropping the POI about 12.5 inches. So if this is the case, just file it down a little at a time until you are right where you want to be. Best wishes.

http://www.tngunparts.com/TALLSIGHTS.html

BTW, the Bulgarian light ball seemed to be a nice group to me.
 

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I understand - Some of my Finn rifles have ho hum accuracy - Some will literally shoot a fly off a bulls ass at a hundred. Each rifle has a preference for ammo(as you most likely know) The trick is to search and find the right ammo that will shoot well in your M39, that may mean reloads... - Of course any rifle with a worn bore will shoot poorly - Other factors include tightening the action screws(My 28-30 shot poorly with a worn bore....I tightened up the loose action screws & the 4 inch group at a hundred shrunk by 50%) - Properly bedded action - The trigger - Shimming the barrel - and the shooter....;)(I have a friend who can't shoot worth beans....:( )

This Tikka M39 is one of my most accurate MN's with Albanian ammo......

Pahtu.
VERY nice group there Pahtu, I am honestly impressed (and envious).

I will have to say, though, you fellers up there on the dry side of WA state sure do get some big flies. Right near to twice the size of two bits. But, I do believe you when you say you could shoot a fly off of a bull's rumpside. By the time that bull quit kicking up dust, that fly would be off of the bull's hindquarters.:D
 

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That rifle is accurate. You have 19 of 20 rounds inside 5 inches vertical and horizontal. That is good grouping. You can compensate by aiming lower but the front sight fix should do the job. The M-39s are impressive rifles.
 

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Well, after saving my pennies and getting an M39, i finally got to the range to try our various ammo. All i can say is that the rifle is precise, but not accurate.

In the picture you can see where the rounds went. In case you're curious, H is Bugarian heavy, B is Bulgarian light, C is Chinese, and 7 is 7N1 sniper. Five rounds each, 19 holes in the paper (missed one Bugarian light) at 100 yards. My aim point was the bottom edge of the target.

This is pretty disappointing. While the rifle is precise enough (i'm not a very good shot) it shoots 10 inches too high. So it is not accurate.

Since the sight is marked for 150 meters, i thought i'd put a target at 200 yards to see how it goes. Never hit paper once. I think the bullets are still going up and over the target at 200 yards.

Does anybody know of a way to "lower" the sight? To hit the bullseye i'd have to shoot 4 inches below the target at 100 yards and around 8 inches below at 200 yards. Shooting further is out of the question.

Any advice? My current review of a Finn is "good," but doesn't have the accuracy of a cheap Russian MN.
If you notice, your Hungarian is grouped within a 1" square. If you were aiming at the bullseye, you're dead on the money! But you need to drift your sight to the left slightly. These battle rifles were set up to shoot 17cm above POA at 100 meters which is 6.6inches. Look at your target. Infantry soldiers were trained to shoot at the belt buckle to score a lethal hit. These are NOT match rifles! Try aiming at a 6 o'clock hold.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
-snip- If you were aiming at the bullseye, you're dead on the money! But you need to drift your sight to the left slightly. These battle rifles were set up to shoot 17cm above POA at 100 meters which is 6.6inches. -snip-.
Ahh indeed, if i was aiming for the bullseye! But i was aiming for the lowest edge of the paper (where the red mark is)! So my group is basically 10 inches to high. Hey, no problem; with my new sight in the mail and excellent advice from the forum, i'll have my sharpshooter up and running in no time.

Of course i'll have to sight in all over again and probably do some filing and other adjustments. But that kind of work is a hell of a lot more fun than sitting in my cubicle!:D

And here's the gun.
 

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"I do believe you when you say you could shoot a fly off of a bull's rumpside."

Yes, the shock wave usually knocks the fly right off.....I will not mention how much damage the bull received.... :)

Plus, I mentioned that the shooting feat could be done at a hundred....Could be a hundred meters, yards, or milimeters :)

Oh yes, the rifle can shoot that well, did not say I could ;)

On a more humorous note - I did shoot a horsefly off a bulls back once....I used my Crosman 760 & three pumps - Not a scratch to the bull - of course it was only five yards away or so....and I was 14 at the time....Don't think I would try that now....;)

Pahtu.
 

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almost appears that there was some "vertical stringing" from a hot barrel, with most of the ammo used. as mentioned by others, i would check the action screws and insure that the barrel is not in contact with the stock. bedding the action should help also and not detract from the appearence of your excellent rifle. my guess is that first 3 shots from a cold barrel grouped very well, although high.
 
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