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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Hey folks, great board you've got here, and very helpful.

This past week a friend of a friend was having a fire sale in order to pay some bills and he mentioned that he was getting rid of a few pieces. One of them was an MM M48. Not knowing anything about Mausers, I got online and did some research and discovered the unsavory rep of MM. Armed with this proof I lowballed the **** out of this guy and he accepted. Lets just say the agreed price was less than what you would spend on a night at the bar or dinner with your wife, gf, or significant other.

At any rate I plan to use this piece as a shooter but wanted to consult the pros to determine how bubba'd this piece is. I noticed that the serial down near the trigger group seems to be really sloppy, but have no explanation other than there was some funny business involved. There is a light layer of cosmo on this, but nothing like the other Zastava pieces that Ive acquired which normally resemble a prehistoric insect entombed in block of amber.

















Thanks guys! Have a great weekend!
 

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i'll let the experts weigh in, but the numbering looks par for the course when it comes to M48s, taletell signs of Mitchells work are thing that are too good to be true, like all maching number deaths head SS sniper rifles and such. the M48s I have (none from Don Mitchell) all look like yours...

I think you got a good deal!
 

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That is a very nice M48. The bore should shine.

Looks to be unissued. Not too common nowdays. Good find.

There is nothing unusual that I can see.

The numbers all look good and are original.

I should mention that unissued M48s from Zastava often had some really bad numbering mistakes on them. I'll skip the details but there were many that I saw straight from the importer.



What makes you think it is a MM?

MM rifles have their import stamp on the front of the barrel. Very small stamping.

If it is not a MM. The import stamp will tell us something about the piece.

FWIW MM M48s are from Zastava and MM has a very close relationship with them.

The only thing I have found on MM is some of the stocks were sanded.

Not all, and I am talking M48s only.

MM K98s have all kinds of fake stuff on them and they are probably the basis for all the MM's bad press, well deserved.

The numbering thing is more for sniper rifles and higher value pieces that will fetch more if the numbers match.
MM from my experience never messed with the numbers on M48. If there were discrepancies with the numbers, it was done by Zastava and probably a parts rifle by the factory for the milsurp market.

Zastava put out some M48s assembled from parts. No telling where all they went besides MM. They had forced matching numbers.

Shooters like MM because most of them have new or like new bores.
Exc. for scoping for long range work. Since collectors say they have no collector value.

If you post the import stamp. I should be able to tell you a bit more about your rifle.

Be aware that there is a lot of difference in 8mm ammo out there. Some will shoot better than others, when you are testing it.

Most of the M48s with new barrels MM or not, are capable of doing MOA @ 100 if the right ammo is used.

Nice find and let us know how it shoots for you and what ammo you use.

Not an expert, but I slept with a M48 at a Holliday INN once.
 

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What a pleasant surprize. I had avoided looking at this thread until now because the title said "Bubba'd". There is not a thing wrong with this rifle. It is an unused M48, not the more common unused M48B.

As far as I am concerned, a Bubba'd rifle doesn't belong in this forum unless it is a very rare model. Certainly a common M1909 Mauser with ruined bolt handle and commercial scope on a D&T receiver does not belong here, regardless of how "pretty" it may be.

Regards,
Bill
 

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What a pleasant surprize. I had avoided looking at this thread until now because the title said "Bubba'd". There is not a thing wrong with this rifle. It is an unused M48, not the more common unused M48B.

As far as I am concerned, a Bubba'd rifle doesn't belong in this forum unless it is a very rare model. Certainly a common M1909 Mauser with ruined bolt handle and commercial scope on a D&T receiver does not belong here, regardless of how "pretty" it may be.

Regards,
Bill
Yep. Using "bubba" for MM is a misnomer and a matter of semantics.

I think there is a difference in a what some call a "bubba" which is a rifle that is modified for practical (or so perceived) reasons and a MM K98 that is altered and misrepresented to sell. In which case it should be called what it is a FAKE.

I could do a page on the origins of the term "Bubba" and how the term evolved on the internet over the last few decades, but that is for another thread.

Most of the MM M48s were in original shape. Not a well known fact with the all the myth and hoopla about MM.

MM is a collectors nightmare, but the M48s were an exception from my experience, and they had some nice ones, unissued and not messed with.

Also not well known is MM sold of large lots of M48s to other vendors. CDN was one that had a batch and all were unissued originals. About ten years or so ago.

The OP's rifle is a fine example of one of these. It is original and unissued. Hell of a find IMO.
 

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My first milsurp was a Mitchel's, an unissued M48bo. I didn't know beans about MM, Yugoslav (or any other make of) Mauser at the time. But I can say now that the M48 I got is as manufactured.

The big beef with MM was based on false advertising and price gouging. At the time I got this, we (My wife got it for me for our 13th wedding anniversary.) paid something like $298 when they were available all over the web in the same condition for $79. I found these forums only after getting the rifle. Live and learn <shrug>.

About the advertising of these, they were listed as M98/48 rifles "made on German equipment" with other references to German making to suggest these were German made for WWII "preserved by a fluke of history." There was lots more along the same line. They have long since cut back on the falsehoods.

Of course, there was/is an "M98/48" but, that isn't what they were selling!
Here are a couple of their older ads that will give you some idea of their BS... http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl...act=rc&uact=3&dur=1941&page=1&start=0&ndsp=17

and... http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl...iact=rc&uact=3&dur=340&page=1&start=0&ndsp=17
 

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I know Nug. They were border line criminal.

I had an article on my old computer from the milsurp forums. It gave the whole story on Don Mitchell and his ties to Zastava.

It was interesting and an eye opener.

Lost the article and my memory isn't that good to give details.

With MM we always treated it like, buy the gun, not the story. They had some really nice unissed M48s that our shooters bought.

I would really like to see one of the MM M/N snipers and see how well they faked them. Assuming they are fakes.
But no one I know of ever bought one.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Hey folks. I'm sorry I didnt get around to addressing this post sooner (the work week and holiday weekend etc), but I do want to thank you all for taking the time to read and respond to my thread. I greatly appreciate it.

It would appear that in my attempts to edit the thread title to remove a certain term that offends the refined sensibilities of collectors (@geladen) I somehow deleted the entire original post? Im sorry, I did make an attempt to read the stickies prior to posting but this forum has an obscene amount of content I definitely overlooked something. My apologies.

At any rate, this piece was definitely a MM import. Here are the requested pics (including a certificate of authenticity (lol?).




 

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I have read/heard that many of these rifles were manufactured for MM, were never used or issued to Yugo military. After all the Yugos went to AK type rifles eons ago and would not have so many un-issued rifles in inventory this late in the game. And we all know the "Tanker Mausers" were made for MM.
So my question would be are they collectable at all? PS; I have one new of ea. model myself (48 & 48A). Also have a 48A which has seen a lot of use, frosty bore and all!
 

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I have read/heard that many of these rifles were manufactured for MM, were never used or issued to Yugo military. After all the Yugos went to AK type rifles eons ago and would not have so many un-issued rifles in inventory this late in the game. And we all know the "Tanker Mausers" were made for MM.
So my question would be are they collectable at all? PS; I have one new of ea. model myself (48 & 48A). Also have a 48A which has seen a lot of use, frosty bore and all!
No the unissued were not made for MM. They also have no history, other than being made by Zastava and stored. Then later sold to importers.
There are lots of used M48s that have a history as being used in the civil war of Yugoslavia.

Collectable? That would be your call, but I can tell you how they came to be.

The unissued M48s were handled by a lot of vendors.

The M76 "Tanker was NOT made for MM" It was made by Zastava and sold all over the world and here in the U.S. sold by more than one vendor.
Some had crests, some didn't.

It may still show it on Zastavas web site for the world market.

They were all new and made in three or four different calibers. Cool truck guns.

Collectability is a subjective concept. There are collectors that collect fakes like Kyber pass rifles and #5MK1 knock offs, (fake). Also Pakistany fabricated rifles that can copy almost any rifle made in the world.

FWIW I think M48s are a very good buy for 8mm. Unissued are getting very rare. I haven't checked with MM to see if they still have any.

For shooting in 8mm the M48s turned out to be one of our favorites. Very accurate and handy.

IMO the OP got one hell of a deal.
 

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To the OP.

No offense intended.

My post was in the spirit of the term Bubba being overused to describe ANY alteration or fake.

People who use "bubba" loosly are usually tagged as wanna bees, newbies, or just tools. Thats in the real world with people who have been around the scene for a long time. it tends to show ignorance about the origins of some of the milsurps that have been faked, altered for sales to naive collectors.

But there are exceptions to that also so my comment is in gen. terms.

You stated that you asked someone about the MM and they replied that MM M48s are bubbas. That is not correct, but it is an example of what I was trying to convey and maybe its time someone corrected some of the myths that have taken root in the forums.

I beilieve that it may be better to call a spade a spade and call a piece what it really is.

MM does not Bubba rifles. They have fakes and misrepresent them in their advertising.

As mentioned before MM also has unissued rifles that have not been messed with. But that fact is completey drowned out by the crowd yelling and bashing MM.
Thats how myths are started and perpetuated.

A Bubba job is one that was altered to make it more user friendly for practical reason. In any case that was the original idea of using bubba.

There is enough myth, B.S. and hoopla on the internet as it is.

So I pointed that out and how Bubba got demonized by the new collector crowd.

I am well aware that it would ruffle a feathers with certain types on these forums.

You have a nice M48, it should be an exc. shooter or just to keep as is.

The MM certificate is total B.S. and is worthless.



Good luck.
 

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I'm no fan of MM, believe me! But, in all fairness, this is my first milsurp that started my collecting interest. It's an M48bo, 1st model, unissued and all proper and correct. It was my 13th anniversary present. Still have it and the wife too, over 25 years now.

 

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MM..DID..Refurb many of the stocks..POORLY...I wouldnt put it past them to renumber a bolt to match

But over all they did not do to the M48 series the way they did the Russian Capture K98k..there they renumbered and altered markings..the famous Rusian X turned into an asterisk etc.

other than that they just distort the provenance and charged to much

OP...your rifle is original finish..many were simply pulled from the crate and placed in the MM box grease and all

The refinished stocks begin to leach cozmoline and get quite ugly/patchy after some time or immediately after being left in a hot car
 

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My first milsurp was a Mitchel's, an unissued M48bo. I didn't know beans about MM, Yugoslav (or any other make of) Mauser at the time. But I can say now that the M48 I got is as manufactured.

The big beef with MM was based on false advertising and price gouging. At the time I got this, we (My wife got it for me for our 13th wedding anniversary.) paid something like $298 when they were available all over the web in the same condition for $79. I found these forums only after getting the rifle. Live and learn <shrug>.


About the advertising of these, they were listed as M98/48 rifles "made on German equipment" with other references to German making to suggest these were German made for WWII "preserved by a fluke of history." There was lots more along the same line. They have long since cut back on the falsehoods.

Of course, there was/is an "M98/48" but, that isn't what they were selling!
Here are a couple of their older ads that will give you some idea of their BS... http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl...act=rc&uact=3&dur=1941&page=1&start=0&ndsp=17

and... http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl...iact=rc&uact=3&dur=340&page=1&start=0&ndsp=17
Wow. What total lies! I lol'ed at "supplies will not last long."
 

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Hey painterjohn, brings back memories, and an odd happening.

The cosmo problem was a PITA. Cosmo got on everything when shooting in the summer.

There was a fellow on Parallax's board that was an expert at wood working.
Can't recall his handle.

It was unusual to get the solution to the problem from a forum that is essentually a purists forum.

He came up with the "spit coat" concept. IIRC it was using shellac to seal the cosmo in.

It worked well. No more cosmo problems.

We struggled with the problem for a time. I discoverd the cosmo is practically impossible to get out. Some of it soaked the wood to an inch or more.

We actually cut into some stocks on shot out rifles to see how deep the cosmo penetrated the wood.

On Enfields it was at time soaked all the way to the metal contacts.

So it was impossible to get the cosmo out of a stock like that.

The guys handle was Cabinet maker or something like that.

BTW Nug. That BO is a keeper.

I can remember one M48 MM that I bought from CDN. The action was like butter and VERY accurate, new bore.

Only problem was the stock had been sanded with what looked like a BELT sander. Really bad work.

Otherwise a nice rifle.
 

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On a side note. I can post this now, wouldn't have mentioned it years ago.

To make the point think seventies or newer Yugo ammo. Initially it sold for about $60 per 900 rnd. case.
When I and other blabbed about how good it shot on the forums. The price within a few months doubled and trippled and more.

So I discoverd its best to keep a good thing to yourselves until you have bought all you will ever want.

This is also the case with MM M48s unissed.

All the hysteria about MM fakes etc. was in our favor.

Our gun club members would buy MM for shooters and the supply did not dry up for years. They may still have unissued M48s for all I know.

Since the "collectors" shuned MM. We had a good supply of unissued rifles for years.

Moot point now. We are all to old to care.
 
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