[DRAGON64]

Let me start by saying, that I always thought the SMLE line of rifles were so ugly, that they were sexy! But becuse they fire the hard-to-find 303 cartridge, I just never took an interest in them... Until today; Today I found out that the SMLE can be had in the NATO 7.62X51 cartridge. Did you know this? Of course you did, I'm the loser who has been in the dark all this time... So I find one on the CMP forums this morning... This SMLE 2A1 was so unique to me that I just had to have it, so I posted an "I'll Take IT!" Oh What Have I Done?

Please tell me I did good... I know nothing about the rifle, as I am waiting on answers to my questions to the seller. Maybe some pictures will help (?)

**Note: The following images are not mine, they belong to "garandgary" from the CMP forums.

I don't know if the numbers match, or if the stock is cracked, or if the rifle is damaged, either cosmetically or mechanically... I just know I had to have it... Please help ease my mind and tell me I did good. tell me why I did good (if).

 

[ditchtiger]

You did good, these are new made rifles, not converted from a .303.
Now go out and find the jungle carbine. Both will hold 12 rounds and are good shooters.
I've one of each.

 

[DRAGON64]

Not being a conversion really was the kicker for me... my only concern now is locating 7.62X51 surplus, as I understand these SMLE 2A1 rifles don;'t take to kindly to being fed 308 Winchester (commercial) loads...

 

[limpetmine]

.... as I understand these S<LE 2A1 rifles don;'t take to kindly to being fed 308 Winchester (commercial) loads...

Who keeps putting this malarkey out there? .308 Win and 7.62 x 51 are the same thing. Google that for a rip righteous debate about a clock with both hands pointing up. One side says it's midnight and one side says it's noon.

Nice rifle, too. Ya done good!

 

[DK PHILLIPS]

nice

 

[JB White]

Dragon64, you did ok. For all practical purposes the rounds are the same given similar loadings. Problems can/will arise with reloads when using the thinner commercial brass. Hence all the "sky is falling" stories. Now someone will chime in with all the chamber specs and PSI/CUP numbers to make an argument...which is moot when using new unfired cases.

You did good, these are new made rifles, not converted from a .303.
Now go out and find the jungle carbine. Both will hold 12 rounds and are good shooters.
I've one of each.

I beg to differ since what we call a 'jungle carbine' is the No5 rifle and uses the same 10 round 303 mag as the No4 rifle. If you are refering to the 2A1 version in 7.62, then those are strictly aftermarket chop and bob jobs with questionable pedigrees. Especially in regard to QC. Didn't mean to burst your bubble if you weren't aware but it's best to know if you hadn't already.
Look up a Gibbs No7 (as opposed to the rimfires in the British No7 and the Canadian CNo7) and you'll see what I mean.

 

[DRAGON64]

Who keeps putting this malarkey out there? .308 Win and 7.62 x 51 are the same thing. Google that for a rip righteous debate about a clock with both hands pointing up. One side says it's midnight and one side says it's noon.

Nice rifle, too. Ya done good!

Dragon64, you did ok. For all practical purposes the rounds are the same given similar loadings. Problems can/will arise with reloads when using the thinner commercial brass. Hence all the "sky is falling" stories. Now someone will chime in with all the chamber specs and PSI/CUP numbers to make an argument...which is moot when using new unfired cases.



I beg to differ since what we call a 'jungle carbine' is the No5 rifle and uses the same 10 round 303 mag as the No4 rifle. If you are refering to the 2A1 version in 7.62, then those are strictly aftermarket chop and bob jobs with questionable pedigrees. Especially in regard to QC. Didn't mean to burst your bubble if you weren't aware but it's best to know if you hadn't already.
Look up a Gibbs No7 (as opposed to the rimfires in the British No7 and the Canadian CNo7) and you'll see what I mean.

It is not so much the size I would think, as it is the pressures. I was planning to start with a handload I built for my M1 Garand; It is mild, and closely resembles ball ammunition. I don't remember the amount of IMR-4895 I used, but I was topping the load off with a 155gr Nosler Custom Competition bullet. I also have some IMR-4064 I could use. Regardless, I have some 1964 LC match cases that I can use for the effort. I'm really looking forward to getting this little beauty now...

 

[JB White]

Milder loads in LC cases are perfect for what you want in the rifle you have. Of course you'll still need to constantly check for signs of incipent seperation...as we must always do.

For the sake of public reading, I would begin with virgin brass and not multi fired or scrounged cases.

 

[bones92]

You will like the 2A1. They are known for being very accurate rifles.

 

[RH7777]

I didn't catch what you paid for it. But it looks like a nice one.

About the .308 ammo thing.

Not to worry Vic just upgraded the forums to over a mega bazillion of them there bites or whatever they are called.

All set for the debate about 2A s and .308 ammo. Should take about thirty pages or so judging from past experience.

Tongue in cheek.

Enjoy your purchase. Mine was a good shooter, not great, but good and fun to shoot. Ammo should be easy to find.

Can't give any accuracy info. on the 2A in gen. Not a big enough sampling to say.

One I had. was in exc. and the only problem I had with it was it would not eject the brass very well. Our club gunsmith fixed it for me and it was a hoot to shoot.

I shot a wide variety of .308 in mine. No hand loads. Never a problem with the ammo.

 

[Alan De Enfield]

Just to say :

308 & 7.62 chamber dimensions are different
308 & 7.62 Headspace dimensions are different

Further info available if requested.

 

[sksguide]

These guns were made in India using Indian steel. As it turns out the Indian steel was capable of handling the power of the 308 /7.62 NATO. India has some of the finest and the most iron ore of anywhere. These rifles were issued to the police in the 60s as well as military. ( later India issued there own version of the AK47 to some troops). These SMLE versions are well built to milspec tolerances and always shoot very well. A great addition to any collection. the year should be on the right side with various arsenal marks on the stock metal band just under the bolt handle. what year is yours?

 

[RH7777]

Not being a conversion really was the kicker for me... my only concern now is locating 7.62X51 surplus, as I understand these SMLE 2A1 rifles don;'t take to kindly to being fed 308 Winchester (commercial) loads...

Mine took very kindly to all the .308 commercial ammo I shot in it.

I didn't hear about the "DEBATE" on using .308 commercial ammo vs. 7.62X51 until years after I sold the rifle.

But as Limpetmine said. Get some popcorn google the debate and read up on it for a couple of days. Then go out and shoot whatever .308 commercial ammo or 7.62X51 whatever you can find. It all worked well for me in my 2A1.

 

[5th Batt WWCT]

Google that for a rip righteous debate about a clock with both hands pointing up. One side says it's midnight and one side says it's noon.

When the hands of a clock are both pointing up in NZ it does not matter if its midnight or noon here, as the rest of you you're just living in the past anyway

 

[limpetmine]

:laugh:

When the hands of a clock are both pointing up in NZ it does not matter if its midnight or noon here, as the rest of you you're just living in the past anyway

 

[RH7777]

When the hands of a clock are both pointing up in NZ it does not matter if its midnight or noon here, as the rest of you you're just living in the past anyway

Maybe.

Have you checked your clock to see if it properly chambered and balanced for the hands on it?

I am sure you have heard, that if you use steel hands on a clock that is made for a lighter material, like plastic etc. it will malfunction and possibly blow. For sure strip the inner workings of its gears. Catastrophic failure.

Or when the hand is supposed to move, it just jumps a bit due to the weight of the steel and never really advances. Just sits there and jumps a bit like a flinching.

It must be true. I read it on Wicki.

Besides, when its midnite down under. The hands should be both at what is our six o clock position. Tell me it ain't so.

OK, only about 29 more pages on .308 and 7.62 and we should get a handle on the problem.

 

[Holbrook]

Nice looking rifle. I love the one we picked up it shoots great groups, tests done from a lead sled. I used 168gr m1a ammo 1st, next up was 147 gr 7.62 NATO from Winchester great ammo. Then the final test was with 308 win. 150 gr. I feel the 147 gr done best as in group wise. The 168gr was ok but hit low. The 308 was a close second but I tend to feel soft primer are not the way to go in any mil spec rifle. No case appeared deformed or other wise stretched. I have read a lot on these two rounds and the units of measurement I advise to look into this subject and use your own judgement. My M1a will fire both rounds and is also recommended to do so. Only hand loads are advised against in it as per the owners manual and 10 safety tags that it came with. I feel these rifle have can be very accurate and have good potential. I tore my down cleaned it and gave it a good one over. Some say not to take an Enfield down, I say know what your doing if you do. Best of luck and I think you will be happy. Here are a couple of pics of what mine done. Shots fired from a lead-sled and using 168gr. The center mass hole was fired last and not part of the grouping. It was a lets see if I can shot.

 

[RH7777]

How many yards??

 

[5th Batt WWCT]

Besides, when its midnite down under. The hands should be both at what is our six o clock position. Tell me it ain't so.

Six o clock am or pm ? Yesterday, today, tomorrow or a week ago late Friday?
& you all thought the 7.62 vs 308 debate was tough!

 

[RH7777]

Six o clock am or pm ? Yesterday, today, tomorrow or a week ago late Friday?
& you all thought the 7.62 vs 308 debate was tough!

My point exactly. Non of that am pm stuff matters. One has to figure in other aspects, like if it was a leap year it throws everything off.

AND as Einstein said "its all relative, depending on the point of observation"

True that.

Naw, I wasn't involved in the debate. It was of no interest to me, but I remember some of the show. It was entertaining at times.
Probably still going on somewhere on the internet.

Good thing I shot mine way before the internet debates. I would have had to get my affairs in order before going to the range.
Never know when it all goes BOOOOM. OOOOOPs