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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
An Industry Operations Inspector showed up at my door unannounced this afternoon requesting a C&R FFL compliance inspection. I was pretty surprised since I thought (based on past scuttlebutt) that they generally call first for us C&Rs. We briefly spoke at the door about me bringing my books and guns down to his office and then I figured "oh what he hell." He came in and sat down in my lving room and I brought him my book. He looked through it and complimented me on it being in good shape except for three back-to-back dispositions missing the dates. I was able to correct two of those fairly quickly due to old emails (he was kind enough to wait on me) and told me I could call him with the last date (transfer to another FFL....I have a call in to them right now.) He asked how frequently I take inventory/how I track my inventory (but did not ask to see any guns), ran through a few of the regulations, and requested to see my FFL and driver's license. He did not want me to bring my FFL to him but asked to see it as it was displayed. I complied. The whole thing lasted about 45 minutes. All in all, it wasn't too bad, although it was a bit unnvering, especially since I've never had a compliance inspection since I've had my FFL.
 

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How long have you had your C&R and how many guns have you sold versus still in your collection???
 

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So now it's unannounced "Pop Quiz" inspection season on C&R holders, eh? Interesting, thanks for posting about it.

The taking inventory and tracking inventory inquiries, along with the request to view the 'license on display', shows the inspector doesn't quite "get it" with the C&R.

Did he take copies or notes of your records? I'm curious what he wants you to call in with that last missing date for - to complete his copy of your records or just to make sure you complete yours?
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 · (Edited)
Credentials? He had a badge, a photo ID and card in a wallet holder, business cards, a folder with the BATF logo embossed on the cover, and several printouts with my name and FFL number on them. No 24 hours notice though...he came to the door and asked to come in, reminding me he had the authority/rigth to inspect. We briefly spoke about him coming unexpectedly and me bringing my guns down to his office and then I let him in. He ddin't appear to copy anything nor did he take anything of mine with him. He did give me another copy of the 2005 white book and a phone number list of BATF offices and contacts.

As far as guins in/guns out, most are still in my possession, with only a few being sold/traded off/parted out over the years. This was my first inspection since I obtained a C&R FFL back in 2002.

Simedog, I think he wants that final date so he can say his inspection went Okey Dokey...he did say he would wait on my call to him with that information before he wrote his report so I'd say, IMHO, it's to make sure my records are complete and that he can give me clean bill of helath. He also said, several times, my books looked fine otherwise, and I asked him point-blank if my FFL was in jeopardy because of those missing dates. He replied "no." But yes, he seemed pretty well "to get it" with regards to C&R FFLs. He knew the regs and even said his biggest concern when dealing with C&R FFL-holders was that many either didn't keep records or kept poor records. About teh only questionable thing was when he said that upon ceasing FFL activity records were to be sent to the Out Of Business Center. I questioned him on that and he corrected himself by saying that it wasn't required for a C&R FFL-holder to surrender thier books, but that they "appreciated" it.
 

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He may have to right to inspect, but he does not have the right to come into your home without a warrant!!! Where does it say you have to display a copy of your C&R? I would have made him set on the front porch, and it's 27 degrees out side!!
 

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I was going to say before your last sentence, that it was required for C&R's to turn in their books, but it looks like you know that. I've been thinking on getting mine and I have been doing a little reading. That portion is still fresh in the mind. Glad you survived okay.
 

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Geez, kids...

Bill gets a simple inspection, everything goes fine, and the same tin-foil-hat types still roll out the "Gestapo" slurs and talk about if it had been at their house, they'd have resisted for no real reason other than just to be asses. (And I'd bet that most of the ones who fantasize about being rude to an ATF guy just because he's an ATF guy don't even have C&R's)

If you don't want to comply with the rules surrounding the C&R, then don't get one and just have all of the guns you want shipped to a gun shop.

You notice though that Bill wasn't a tool to the guy and it was quickly concluded with no problems. That's how it generally works in the big-people world. You offer basic courtesy and you typically get it back in return.
 

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Whoops! I meant to say "that is was NOT required for C&R's to turn in their books..."
 

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Geez, kids...

Bill gets a simple inspection, everything goes fine, and the same tin-foil-hat types still roll out the "Gestapo" slurs and talk about if it had been at their house, they'd have resisted for no real reason other than just to be asses. (And I'd bet that most of the ones who fantasize about being rude to an ATF guy just because he's an ATF guy don't even have C&R's)

If you don't want to comply with the rules surrounding the C&R, then don't get one and just have all of the guns you want shipped to a gun shop.

You notice though that Bill wasn't a tool to the guy and it was quickly concluded with no problems. That's how it generally works in the big-people world. You offer basic courtesy and you typically get it back in return.
Amen brother! ;)
 

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Ugh! Unexpected ATF house-calls! What will they try next?

Sounds like you weathered it alright, but I would have been heartily ticked-off had my local agent just shown up at my home.

T
 

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Geez, kids...

Bill gets a simple inspection, everything goes fine, and the same tin-foil-hat types still roll out the "Gestapo" slurs and talk about if it had been at their house, they'd have resisted for no real reason other than just to be asses. (And I'd bet that most of the ones who fantasize about being rude to an ATF guy just because he's an ATF guy don't even have C&R's)

If you don't want to comply with the rules surrounding the C&R, then don't get one and just have all of the guns you want shipped to a gun shop.

You notice though that Bill wasn't a tool to the guy and it was quickly concluded with no problems. That's how it generally works in the big-people world. You offer basic courtesy and you typically get it back in return.
+1
Other than no notice which is kinda rude it sounds like it went the right way.
 

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Actually, Mr Harper's Ferry High-Horse Person, this is the first time most (or all?) of us have heard of inspectors showing up without a call first to agree on a time, etc.

And as for the rest of your tone, it's not about having "basic courtesy" or not. I hope it's not a surprise to you that most of us would like a minimum of Gov't intrusion in our lives. Yes, those of us with C&R's have made a distasteful compromise in that regard in order to make collecting easier or cheaper, or feasible at all in some cases. But that still doesn't mean we want any more intrusion than we have "signed up" for. We're always trying to clarify where those boundary lines are, so we know where we can legally stand our ground and where we have to comply. There's at least a couple new features about Bill's inspestion that are "new ground" as far as most of us are aware.
 

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My son currently has 7 teenage friends blocking my access to my basement office, so I can't get at my C&R files. Please refresh my memory...does the law allow for unannounced C&R inspections? I thought it did not.
 

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Wow, what BS. Glad I gave up my 03FFL if this is going to be the new SOP. Personally, I would've asked him to schedule an appointment and state I was on my way out the door and then leave. Nowhere in the 03 rules does it make allowance for spot inspections.
 

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I don't have a C&R and I've had a chat with the BATF. It was in reguards to a hand gun that was sold legally but was smuggled out of the country. If you want to make your live hell go ahead and screw with the BATF and you'll find out you don't have some the rights you think you do. If your in complience why would you not want to make it go smooth and easy? Here's something to think about. Yes, you don't have to let him in and you can arrange a meeting with your book and any paperwork requested. Or be a jerk, piss them off and they can come to your door with force sieze all firearms, computers, assets (this includes your vehicles and house) becouse YOU HAVE RiGHTS.
 
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