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Peened barrel & receiver stamps, these rifles are often referred to as "Balkan" rifles, where their final place of service in a former Soviet country is.....up for some debate - Frequently these have unknown letter stamps, what they represent nobody knows......Unless Ratniks book has shed some light.....

Pahtu.
 

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Can you take and post more pictures? Any other markings, stock markings or repairs, is there a "wedge" under the rear sight usually center punched on edges to keep in place? I would of guessed Balkan/Romanian but the crest doesn't appear to be ground down but picture is poor. Some were ground down a lot and some were not. But it doesn't looked terribly messed with but again the pics are dark and not very descriptive. I am very new to SCW rifles and traits too. But if the rifle is not obviously Finn SA marked or have the rear sight marks lined out and restamped on right side of rear sight base, those are the normal guesses. Need more pics with more details. I think many of the Romanian imports had a "G" added to prefix or end of SN but not where your "G" is stamped. The Serb rifles I though had a "C" stamped but don't recall the "G". The Serb "C" was stamped in the same place on a few of my rifles. At this point I am only guessing but more pics will aluminate or eliminate some of the guessing. Regards, John.

added later: I am leaning Serb "G". Remember trying to wrap my head around the Serb rifles a long time ago. Can't recall for sure but the "G" is not the same a English "G" and may have translated into meaning Serb heritage. Been a long time and while maybe a few collectors can tell you for sure I felt like a lot of the Serb info was speculative? There was some good info on Serbs, but felt it sketchy going on my sketchy memory of it all. I picked up a 1895 Tula with Serb C, but all the normal "Balkan import" traits. Though in way better condition than the last imported batch and mine is not import marked?
 

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So for the balkan rifles, we have narrowed down to what countries?

Romania, Serbia, what others?

Have we seen certain letters attributed to certain countries?

I have a 1917 Tula with a F suffix added to the S/N, but the crest isnt scrubbed.
 

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No I don't think anybody narrowed it down to bare facts. I think the last batch of CAI imports were thought to be Romanian. As stated above I have a rifle with Serbian "C" but also has the later so called "Balkan" traits with no import marks and in much better condition. I think Serb ownership goes further back say pre 1920s? These rifles have traveled and fought a lot of wars and skirmishes and unless they start talking I think we more or less go by what we know and the rest is speculation a lot of the time. Some of this stuff is so used and well traveled it is not an exact science most of the time. Terms like "Balkan imports" {I use this loosely quite often} or "Finn Captured" are used by many people very loosely while the description and facts may vary tremendously to what is actually being talked about. Finn captured is being used for every mix master M91 that comes about, probably grossly inaccurate. We share and try to learn. I do not know what all the prefixes and suffixs mean? I just have seen the "G" on some of the later CIA imported M91s. Regards, John.
 

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In that case I would go by each rifles characteristics if I am getting your statement correctly. I do not recall seeing Austrian capture markings on the later Balkan rifles but what do I know? Very little {my knowledge} is the truth. Just another guess on my part is the Austrian trait rifles probably went to Finland and the rest is anybodys guess. If they came in the same batch from an importer I would guess you got some of two separate piles. If they came from a collection I again would just take each rifles hx one at a time and go with what you got for signs/symptoms. If you worked at CAI back in the day and unloaded a container that had been untouched since loading I might question the origin more. Again I have limited knowledge and who is to say? Not me. I just know what I read and then still get things twisted around. Regards, John.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
This is the picture of the rifle. This is not Serbian being that has Latin "G". It is all matching except bolt.
 

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Looks to be force matched. Old numbers ground off and re stamped. Balkan looking font. The numbers look a little taller and slightly less in diameter than Russian fonts. Maybe it's the eye, but the fonts are different. Interesting the G is not as a letter suffix after the serial number. But it does look like the Imperial eagles were slightly defaced. But doesn't look as bad as a typical Balkan M91, which have the imperial marks totally filed, ground or sanded off.
 

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With the new pics it has or seems to have a lot of the later "Balkan" import traits. But the "G" stamped where it is I can only guess. Like IC says it is not suffix or prefix to sn# and that very well maybe a clue to an earlier incarnation or home country. The so called "Balkan imports" that I think were the last major importation of M91 were probably from Romania so the story goes {I think} but who had them before Romania could of been just about anybody but maybe Finland. Hope more info about the "G" comes forward. Been a while since I reread the articles about the Serb rifles. So many countries in the area that actually used the M91s quickly converted to Mouser rifles and the surplus value of M91s were not much unless you were really down and out. Foreign aid type stuff. Like us giving the Greeks our 1903 Springfields post WW2 when even the poorest countries were now armed with semi autos. We didn't have Cap'n Crunch at the time I guess. Even the really worn out "Balkan imports" can be interesting to check out to see what kind of history they might show. The really bad ones are one step above rebar, I have a couple of them. So you going to show pics of the other one you got?? Regards, John.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Picture of the Serbian one. They did not remove eagles of this one. It does have W stamped on the stock right in front of metal butt plate. That is austrian proof marked. It completely mismatched.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
I think there may a few origins with the Cs on these. I've seen them dated into the 20s with a couple and that shouldnt be Serbian that late correct?
It should not be into 1920 because this rifles were given to Serbians as a help in ww1. And after that soviet Russians did not like us too much because we took in lot of White Russians after the civil war. Next time we got mosin rifles from Russians was after 1944-45 at the end of ww2.
 

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Rajko84, thought I had photos of this rifle but not any on PB so I shot a few indoors which is usually not good. But thought I would share what I think is a Serb/Balkan that I picked up probably 10 years ago or so. It has the "Balkan wedge" in rear sight base but did not take picture of it this time around. Is not import marked and has matching numbers except for bolt. As you can see the Eagles were removed but most of the chamber markings are intact unlike some that are totally molested. Thinking back I almost remember someone suggesting that the "C" on my rifle was a poorly stamped "G"? Anyway thought it might pertain to the discussion. Later, John.






 

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It should not be into 1920 because this rifles were given to Serbians as a help in ww1. And after that soviet Russians did not like us too much because we took in lot of White Russians after the civil war. Next time we got mosin rifles from Russians was after 1944-45 at the end of ww2.
The latest I've had with the C is a 1918 Tula but I have seen a 1919 and a 1920 dated one with the C also.
 

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I checked a little more today, and I have a 1916 PTG, Instructie marked rifle, with an F Suffix.

Edited my earlier post.

Several of the balkan m91s I just acquired also have Austrian capture marks/stocks. Those in question do not have any Finnish marks on them, or modified rear sights.
 
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