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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
:eek:
I am having some issues with my 1944 ishy 91/30
when i first got it back in november i could hit a coke can and a pumpkin at 200 yards.... hitting to the right of my point of aim..

i took it to the range about a month ago and i did well at 100 and 50 yards usually putting them all witih 8 inches of my targets dead center... with it still shooting to the right...

took it out yesterday to the range and at 50 yards all of my shots were off of the paper and to the right about 10in and low about 5inwith good grouping but at 100 yards it did much better i could actually hit the 8in target??????

im confused, i was impressed with its accuracy when i first got it and now i dont know what to say it has progressively gotten worse.

info: its an ex-sniper with plugged holes with a bright and shiny bore and i always clean my guns thorougly after corrosive shooting..

what to do??????:eek:
 

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Where do you live? It's heating season, and with the heat on, many houses get very dry inside during the winter. Your stock could have lost just enough extra moisture to change the bedding a bit, and throw off the point of aim.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
middle tn, and that makes sense its been cold and the heats been pumping and alot of cosmo has weapt out.
 

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check all bedding screws.

clean barrel channel linseed/ wax to seal go shoot again. stocks been changing contacts due to moister changes in house that my guess too.<><dk
 

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Check action screws..

With the Mosin Nagant, tension on the actions screws is very important for accuracy. Usually pretty tight on the front screw and a good solid "snug" on the rear tang screw is what seems to work best.

Check out your rifle and see just where your action srews are at this time as it does change.

I usually back my screws out after a shooting session just to get the pressure off the wood and reset them before each shooting session.

Draybo (his .02 along with the others)
 

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Thanks draybo, I bought a 1942 91/30 Tula, it has a bit of a frosty bore, but has good lands, I was a bit disapointed with the accuracy of it at 100 yds, but i'm gonna check the action screws, give them a twist if needed. The weather in Indiana has been cold, warm, rain, snow!!! Good info , good help!!!
 

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Wood warps and changes shape with humidity.
Screw tension is important. Should be set with an inch pound torque screw driver.
Barrel temperature and warping from heating it up, pressing against the stock, will alter point of impact. Identifying and correcting contact points inside the stock or completely free floating the barrel may be necessary.

Elevation and windage with 7.62.54R is something you have to learn.
POI will change from day to day with differing weather conditions, temp, humidity, air density. Some days they go up. Some days they go down. Some days they go sideways! You need to know and understand the characteristics of the particular lot of ammo you are shooting under various conditions.

Bore conditioning and cleaning are a much deeper subject.
Running patches of Hoppes through it until they come out clean is not cleaning! Clean means bare metal spanky clean with copper fouling removal. Fouling that does not come out with conventional cleaning WILL alter accuracy!

Condition of the crown and lap are extremely important to accuracy!
The slightest nick in the crown and lap will throw shots all over.
Get a brass lapping tool from Midway for less than $8.
Proper lapping has vastly improved accuracy on guns I thought were pretty bad, sufficiently so that all my guns have been lapped and repeated as necessary. Proper lapping technique has been previously posted in the forums.
 

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Did you disassemble the rifle for cleaning between trips to the range?

If so...

  1. were the receiver and magazine tang screws returned to approximately the same torque?--this usually changes deflection in elevation, too tight or too loose are both bad
  2. did the front sights get knocked off of its 'punched' or staked positioning?--this usually changes horizontal deflection
  3. is the rear sights damages?
  4. is the fore-end's nosecap making contact on one side of the barrel?--this may cause deflection towards opposite point of contact with barrel
  5. is the muzzle's crown scratched?
  6. is there new damage in the bore?
  7. are you using/not using bayonet the same each range trip?
  8. same ammo?
  9. wind and weather?
  10. you aren't going blind, drunk, poor health, etc?
Most of these are from THE SOVIET MOSIN-NAGANT MANUAL translated by Terence Lapin.
 

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accuracy issues

You talking about something like this ?
1942 91/30 6 rounds on the left 1942 M-38 5 rounds on the right, mixed head stamp ammo, the M-38 is high to the right, the 91/30 repeated this at 100 yds.
 

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Sure sounds like loose action screws to me. The gun would not shoot that poorly due to temperature or humidity causing the stock to change. This is not a match grade bedded target rifle its a militray rifle that fought in the frozen steepes to the steaming deserts of the Gobi. I'd bet my last dollar the action screws are loose and or he banged up the crown.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
idk i know after almost every grouping the upper handguard slides up the barrel and over the lower retaining spring and i have to pull it back down...
and idk about the crow it still looks just as i got it from AIM and it doesn't swallow a bullet and i use the muzzel cap/guard every time i clean it.....
... last time i took it to the rang i noticed that when i got home the screws rettled loose but this past time i checked after every clip..
 

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You need to quantify exactly what is happening ...
Vertical stringing: predictable and reproducible, point of impact shifts up or down in a predictable manner as the barrel heats up with x number of rounds. This is a stock, front barrel band issue where the barrel is warping from heat and being bent by contact with something.
Flyers: random stray shots outside the average grouping. Can just be the quality of the ammo but more likely caused by crown/lap damage.
The slightest nick in the crown or lap causes the gas ring exiting behind the bullet not to be perfectly concentric. Gas applies unequal pressure to one side of the tail end of the bullet causing it to yaw in flight. Fixed with a good lap job and polishing the crown.
Spready group: overall condition of the bore. Excessive copper and powder fouling can shrink bore specs to the point where the bullet is over compressed causing lead to be pushed unevenly into nose or tail. Lopsided bullets don't fly straight. Thorough bore conditioning and slugging/measuring the bore are in order.
Rough spots in the throat, from rust or fouling can deform bullets.
Again, proper cleaning of the chamber and throat can help.
David Tubb's Final Finish bore conditioning bullets will ream and polish this area and may significantly improve overall accuracy. Having used a batch, I concluded they are worth a treatment on all my favorite 7.62x54R shooters and I have a set ready to go through an M39. They do have to be hand loaded.
Bedding: it's really hard to tell how hard or soft the wood in the receiver is without picking at it a little bit. Wood can become soft and very spongy in the critical contact areas after years of soaking up oil. Even though the screws are tight, the receiver is slopping around in soft and battered wood. There may be considerable wear evident around the front lug. Loosen the screws and see if the receiver has any movement in its resting position when you wiggle the barrel. Pillar post epoxy bedding is a "do it yourself" project if you have some patience with small hand tools. There are tutorials in the Workbench forum. A good bedding job and free floating the barrel will yield remarkable results providing the bore is good. "harmonics" caused by various contact points with the forestock and handguard in a milsurp were not a major concern to makers of military battle rifles. Harmonics can be cured by free floating the barrel.
 

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idk i know after almost every grouping the upper handguard slides up the barrel and over the lower retaining spring and i have to pull it back down...
I had that problem on my M39. What I had to do was take a small nail and lightly tap out the retaining springs pin. this popped the back end of the retaining spring out and it caught on the barrel band. then I just push the top end near the pin back flush with the stock.
 
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