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Actually it's not really been on my mind you throw in decades of research huge amounts of funding no shortage of people willing to volunteer and a global market amazing what can be done when large amounts of money are on the line. We take care of a brain surgeons property and asked him if he would get the vaccine and he said " yes I would , there's a lot of unknown about the vaccine but i know what covid can do"
 

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Actually, I felt it could have been done quicker and released, atleast on a limited or voluntary basis, sooner. We need to rethink the idea of emergency vs normal development. Fast rack is fine, but; we need to clearly define a variety of crisis tracks. The death rate was very low. It could have been a lot higher. In this case, I was more worried about the hospital chamber of horrors than the disease itself. Saw that in China too. Sick people, hiding at home rather then end up in isolation on death row.
 

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Correction #1. What is being doled out here are not vaccines, but medications. No where on the Moderna website is this medication ever referred to as a vaccine. While effective at lessening the symptoms they do not prevent anyone from getting the virus. Read again ZERO protection from getting the virus. There are a number of other treatments as effective without being part of an experiment. A large number of people are having severe side effects and dying from these medications/ responses to them. NO data on that is being tabulated by CDC, though there are other studies that are. I was a scientist for many years, did a lot of testing and data comparisons. While in school some of the most of the poorly performing students were pre-med students. I would never ask a brain surgeon for advice on a viral treatment unless maybe it was for encephalopothy and clearly the surgeon who operated on Joe years ago hasn't done follow up exams! According to Faucci's bio he may have spent several months in a lab back in the 70's. Been a government "doctor" ever since, but has never treated or had any patients....same as doctor Jill LOL.

The reality is this virus is not a big deal. In 2020 there was little to no increase in excess mortality from covid vs. 2017 where excess mortality was significantly higher.
Think of the poor 2000 people who were diagnosed with the flu from 9/20 to 4/21. In 2017 possibly 45 million people contracted influenza. Or did 20 million contract influenza and were diagnosed with covid due to an inferior test method (as stated by the inventor of the test method)? Nobody's talking. Did the Faucci funded virus cure influenza?

You will be asked to get re-medicated in the fall, but it will still be experimental and the manufacturers will still be immune from litigation. You'll be asked to wear a mask that is like using chain link fence to keep out mosquitoes in addition to being a petri dish for a variety of other issues.
The good news (for some) is that you a free joint for getting jabbed. They don't say if you're supposed to smoke it before you go in or after you leave. Yes......Washington state, but others will follow.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
@johnsonlmg

You're sharing your opinion as a private citizen?


Pfizer calls their product a vaccine.


Moderna has a covid-19 page in which their product is referred to as a vaccine.

Moderna's business model is to look for broader uses of mRNA, beyond just producing proteins to generate immune response. For example, cancer therapies.

The tinfoil hat stuff, it's people's right to go there. But I can't help but wonder that if the disease mortality was 25% instead of <1%, if there would be a lot less noise. But people still do get Covid-19, and still die of it, and it isn't a pleasant death.
 

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A coworker developed severe arm pain hours after the shot. Doctors told him its probably just arthritis. In a 28 year old. The day he got the shot. Side effect of the shot was never mentioned as a possibility at the ER. A month later & he can't even crumple up a piece of paper.

My mother survived Covid, but almost died from blood clots after getting the shot. But she "may have developed those from something else, they can't be certain".

My point is that side effects are obviously under reported. And we don't even know long-term side effects yet! How much will get downplayed?

Nothing to see here, move along.
 
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What if we have a new disease, the next one, with a death rate of 99%. Do we have a plan? In that situation, a very large risk would be justified to make something very fast.
 

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I developed nerve pain in my arm 2 days after my second shot. The pain runs from my shoulder blade to below my elbow. It has been a month and the pain is still severe at times to the point I can not get comfortable in any position, can't sleep, and can't put any pressure on my arm. I have tried Tylenol, a pressure pad, and immobilization. Last night I resorted to a prescription pain reliever that I have on hand because I didn't need to finish it the last time it was prescribed. Finally had a good night's sleep. I've been told this has nothing to do with the vaccine, but with the injection itself because if they give you the injection too high up on your arm they may hit a nerve bundle. Lucky me I may be the 1 of those 1 in 1000 so effected. In any case, I'm assured the nerve pain will eventually stop and I'm glad I got the vaccine.
 

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I developed nerve pain in my arm 2 days after my second shot. The pain runs from my shoulder blade to below my elbow. It has been a month and the pain is still severe at times to the point I can not get comfortable in any position, can't sleep, and can't put any pressure on my arm. I have tried Tylenol, a pressure pad, and immobilization. Last night I resorted to a prescription pain reliever that I have on hand because I didn't need to finish it the last time it was prescribed. Finally had a good night's sleep. I've been told this has nothing to do with the vaccine, but with the injection itself because if they give you the injection too high up on your arm they may hit a nerve bundle. Lucky me I may be the 1 of those 1 in 1000 so effected. In any case, I'm assured the nerve pain will eventually stop and I'm glad I got the vaccine.
I had shoulder pain for a few days after both shots the second shot came on quicker but wasn't as long or as bad but I have read if you have a lot of arm pain it's because they gave the shot too deep or too high on the shoulder wasn't sure if that was true or not. Hope you're well and the pain goes away
 

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@johnsonlmg

You're sharing your opinion as a private citizen?


Pfizer calls their product a vaccine.


Moderna has a covid-19 page in which their product is referred to as a vaccine.

Moderna's business model is to look for broader uses of mRNA, beyond just producing proteins to generate immune response. For example, cancer therapies.

The tinfoil hat stuff, it's people's right to go there. But I can't help but wonder that if the disease mortality was 25% instead of <1%, if there would be a lot less noise. But people still do get Covid-19, and still die of it, and it isn't a pleasant death.
Sorry not true. Moderna has a page with references to articles that call it a vaccine written by uninformed media and journals, but the company refers to them as mRNA medicines and therapies because that's what they are. Words mean things. The tinfoil on the heads of most liberals and the uneducated means they cannot absorb nor process any data. Very few people die of Covid 19, the vast majority affected die of pneumonia because they end up confining themselves either in a hospital bed at a nursing home or somewhere else, or worse they get the death sentence of a ventilator from a physician. Worse yet some sick people were ordered to be put in nursing homes to spread the disease....intentionally.

Pfizer does use the term vaccine, because during this experiment they have complete legal immunity, so in this case descriptions for the masses don't create any liability. When the experiment is over you'll see this corrected.
Anecdotally I now know more people who have gotten more ill from the cure than the virus including a stroke victim (yes blood clots are common) who dropped 2 hours after the shot.

Yes sharing this as a private citizen, like many in the medical field who are also citizens that see the same data and have no intention of becoming part of the experiment? Not sure what you're point is? I do not represent a government agency that is immune from any responsibility or repercussions when they are wrong.

Continue to wear the hat, watch only screened youtube videos, facebook news feeds, and cbs nbc abc and you'll be fine. They will tell you everything they think you need to know like the news clown reporting on the mostly peacefull protests with the raging fires in the background. LOL
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
So...SARS-Cov-2 isn't actually a virus, and all of the vaccines developed to confer immunity to the virus aren't actually doing that.

The whole world has it wrong, and a handful of brave contrarians have it right.

Not remotely persuaded. That is as tin-foil as it gets, in my opinion.
 

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I had an achy shoulder for a while, not my worry, I apparently have a
a "shot twitch" in that muscles jumps when you stick a needle in them.. I have broken two needles off below the skin and several above the skin at the connection to the syringe... they have go in with a probe on ones below the skin, and tweezers/ pliers, tiny ones, but still arm hurts a lot the day after doesn't matter what the shot is for.. but there are side effects that never really get discussed ... just make sure the needle is coming at you perpendicular as possible and exhale
 

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Sorry not true. Moderna has a page with references to articles that call it a vaccine written by uninformed media and journals, but the company refers to them as mRNA medicines and therapies because that's what they are. Words mean things. The tinfoil on the heads of most liberals and the uneducated means they cannot absorb nor process any data. Very few people die of Covid 19, the vast majority affected die of pneumonia because they end up confining themselves either in a hospital bed at a nursing home or somewhere else, or worse they get the death sentence of a ventilator from a physician. Worse yet some sick people were ordered to be put in nursing homes to spread the disease....intentionally.

Pfizer does use the term vaccine, because during this experiment they have complete legal immunity, so in this case descriptions for the masses don't create any liability. When the experiment is over you'll see this corrected.
Anecdotally I now know more people who have gotten more ill from the cure than the virus including a stroke victim (yes blood clots are common) who dropped 2 hours after the shot.

Yes sharing this as a private citizen, like many in the medical field who are also citizens that see the same data and have no intention of becoming part of the experiment? Not sure what you're point is? I do not represent a government agency that is immune from any responsibility or repercussions when they are wrong.

Continue to wear the hat, watch only screened youtube videos, facebook news feeds, and cbs nbc abc and you'll be fine. They will tell you everything they think you need to know like the news clown reporting on the mostly peacefull protests with the raging fires in the background. LOL
I really can’t stand people who like to dub themselves “experts” because they are “scientists”. You even said you wouldn’t trust a brain surgeon on viral issues because it’s not their subject area but somehow because you are a “scientist” and not a virologistshould listen to you?

My wife is a nurse and my best Friends wife is a doctor. Naturally we have many friends in the medical space. The ones working in the ICU and the ER all tell me about the stories of people gasping for air as they slowly died from this virus back in the winter when resources were low. The lucky ones got put under on a vent and died in a coma.

Several our our friends lost coworkers to the virus and others are suffering from PTSD from dealing with all the deaths. Back during the peaks it was multiple people per shift passing away. The fact that people like to downplay this virus because it disagrees with their politics is ridiculous. More people died from covid in the US than all of the US soldiers who died in WW2.
 

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Hmm, those people died unnecessarily. HCQ, Ivermectin, budesonide inhalers, zinc, z pack can be effective early treatments (look at India) , but they were demonized by the media. Why? If you are dying, why wouldn’t you take any possible treatment? No, they sent people home to choke on their own spit. Drs refused until court ordered to prescribe HCQ or Ivermectin. As always, follow the money. No money in safe drugs that have been off patent for years and cost nickels. Plus if those drugs work, (they do), no EUA for the ”vaccine.” There’s a bigger agenda here. Not saying I know what it is. But the initial side effects should be the least of your worries. Absolutely no one knows the long term effects. Funny how there was exactly zero flu last year.
 

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So...SARS-Cov-2 isn't actually a virus, and all of the vaccines developed to confer immunity to the virus aren't actually doing that.

The whole world has it wrong, and a handful of brave contrarians have it right.

Not remotely persuaded. That is as tin-foil as it gets, in my opinion.
Remove the foil and maybe you can read? I never said there was no virus. It's quite clear Faucci funded the research and implementation for the lab in Wuhan since those bats never flew 900 miles. The medications put forth by several companies do not meet the definition of a vaccine and they IN NO WAY make you immune from being infected from the virus, they only reduce the symptoms. Proven out by the tens of thousands now testing positive after being fully medicated. Of course more than half of the people that tested positive for the virus never get any symptoms to begin with without any of these medications. And yes as Winder points out there are many alternative treatments that are just as effective.....and not experimental.
A guy named Jim has a bucket of Kool-aid, go ahead drink a cup, you won't feel a thing, sure cure for the rona. LOL

AR If you know people in healthcare that have PTSD from patients that die, they had serious problems before they left the house and need to find different occupations. That's ludicrous. Most hospitals have a morgue.....there is a reason for that. Now maybe you're from NY where your governor created concentration camps? Where do they store all the ventillators that were ordered and never used? Someone's brother in law has a huge storage contract for that whole scam. Sounds like the doctors you know prescribed the deadly use of ventillators? Scary.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
@johnsonlmg

All over the map!

Which medicines in the claim do not qualify as vaccines? Which do?

Are you a vaccine expert or offering a layman's opinion on the subject?

Plus treating wild unsubstantiated claims as though they're proven fact.

Long story short, this line of argument being put forth against vaccines is an incoherent hot mess. There may be a sound argument against them somewhere, particularly some of the off brand offerings out of Russia/China, but not here, not yet.

BTW, get used to seeing mRNA based pharmacology.
 

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@johnsonlmg

All over the map!

Which medicines in the claim do not qualify as vaccines? Which do?

Are you a vaccine expert or offering a layman's opinion on the subject?

Plus treating wild unsubstantiated claims as though they're proven fact.

Long story short, this line of argument being put forth against vaccines is an incoherent hot mess. There may be a sound argument against them somewhere, particularly some of the off brand offerings out of Russia/China, but not here, not yet.

BTW, get used to seeing mRNA based pharmacology.
mRna technology may very well be appropriate in a cancer patient who‘s got a 50% chance of dying. It’s not appropriate in a mass vaccination of the populace who have a .02% chance of dying. And it’s criminal to use on youth <18 who have statistically a 0% chance of death.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
mRna technology may very well be appropriate in a cancer patient who‘s got a 50% chance of dying. It’s not appropriate in a mass vaccination of the populace who have a .02% chance of dying. And it’s criminal to use on youth <18 who have statistically a 0% chance of death.
Another expert? Some numbers are tossed out but others are omitted behind innuendo.

The fact remains, everywhere these two mRNA vaccines see extensive use, covid-19#s drop like a rock, and normalcy returns.

I get that there will be minority opinions on the vax, but to the extent that real-world results matter, that's the reality. And they're holding up well so far against mutations of the virus.

In the US, the pandemic is effectively over for those who got the vax. The holdouts have to take their chances.

What I don't understand is the holdouts waging anti-vax campaigns. It should be enough if no one is forcing them to get the shot. Using lies and tricks to persuade others, that to me is wrong.
 
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