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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Hello Gents,

The following photos do not include all of the bayonets in my collection, however this will provide a starting point for a permanent thread that will eventually include proper identification per recognized period German and recognized collector nomenclature in the case of the ersatz models. In the interim, I will just post the photos I have readily available.

I hope these photos are of help to those of you among the crowd who are bayonet collectors!

Warmest regards,

JPS
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Ersatz bayonets with knife blades
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 · (Edited)
Ersatz bayonets with blades from obsolete socket bayonets
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 · (Edited)
Regulation Pattern Bayonets ~ An Overview
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 · (Edited)
German Regulation Pattern Bayonets of WWI

The following photos were originally intended to be the basis of this "stickied" thread. While once again, these photos do not represent the entire German section of the Collection, they do include the majority of the different bayonets Germany issued during WWI. The Collection includes many duplicates of most of these bayonets but for one reason or another, these are the examples I chose to photograph.

The following photos were originally taken for Johan Somers' most recent three volume set of books covering the Imperial German Army from 1907 through 1918. The three volume set is truly amazing and I was honored to have contributed to Johan's effort, both in terms of photos of examples of rifles and bayonets from my collection, as well as to have provided written sections and captions. The work includes the following volumes:


The Imperial German Armies in Field Grey Seen Through Period Photographs, 1907-1918: Uniforms, Headgear, Weapons, Gas Warfare, Telephone and Communications Equipment ~ Volume I




The Imperial German Armies in Field Grey Seen Through Period Photographs, 1907-1918: Infantry, Jager, Schutzen, Radfahrer, Mountain Troops and Machine Gunners ~ Volume 2



The Imperial German Armies in Field Grey Seen Through Period Photographs, 1907-1918: Cavalry, Artillery, Pioneers, Transport, Train, Medical, Miscellaneous Formations ~ Volume 3



I highly recommend this three volume set that covers a vast cross section of the uniforms, weapons and equipment of the Imperial German Army leading up to and through the course of WWI. A large number of our fellow members here on the WWI Forum made valuable contributions to this remarkable work. It is particularly valuable in terms of the timing of the publication of these books with this being the first year of100th Anniversary of the Great War.

With the wealth of data collected by Johan for this amazing work, not all of these photographs appeared in the published work. It is my pleasure to share all of the photos with you Gentlemen.

Warmest regards,

JPS
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 · (Edited)
Bavarian S1869 Werder Bayonet with Shortened Blade



S1869 Werder Bayonets ~ Standard Issue ~ Single-Step Conversion for 71, 71/84 and 88 Rifles ~ Double-Step Conversion for 71, 71/84 and 88 Rifles



S1869 Werder Bayonets ~ Standard ~ Single-Step Conversion ~ Double-Step Conversion ~ WWI S69/98 Conversion




German S1871 Mauser Bayonet





S1871 Sawback Bayonet



S1871 with WWI Metal Scabbard

 

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Discussion Starter · #7 · (Edited)
German S1860 with Bushed Muzzle Ring for the issue with the M1871 Mauser Rifle




German S1871 converted to a Sidearm during WWI




German S1871 Hirschfanger for Jaeger Regiments Mauser Rifles




German S1871/84 Mauser Bayonets including a Sawback Example




German S1871/84 Mauser Bayonet comparison with Conversion to 1st Pattern S84/98

 

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Discussion Starter · #8 · (Edited)
German S1884/98 Mauser Bayonets

German S1871/84 conversion to S1884/98 1st Pattern




German S1884/98 2nd Pattern with Flash-guard and Standard Leather Scabbard



German S1884/98 2nd Pattern with Flash-guard, Trench Art Bone Grip Panels and Steel Scabbard



German S1884/98 2nd Pattern Variations ~ Sawback Removed w Flash-guard ~ Sawback w Flash-guard ~ 1st Pattern Conversion from 71/84




German S1898 Mauser Bayonets

S1898 a-A Early Grip Variations ~ WWI Cut-Down Blade ~ Standard Blade ~ Sawback Blade



German Mauser S1898 n-A variations ~ Standard Blade w WWI Steel Scabbard ~ Sawback Blade ~ with Flashguard


 

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Discussion Starter · #9 · (Edited)
German S1898 Mauser Bayonets


German Mauser S1898 n-A Bayonet with Standard Issue Leather Scabbard



German Mauser S1898 n-A Bayonet with WWI Steel Scabbard



S1898 a-A Walking Out Bayonet with WWI Cut-Down Blade



German Mauser S1898 n-A Bayonet with WWI Cut-Down Blade and Steel Scabbard




German KS1898 Mauser Sawback Bayonet


German KS98 Sawback Bayonets ~ Official Issue with Leather Grip Panels ~ Two Erfurt Mfg. with Wooden Grip Panels & Steel Scabbards



German Private Purchase KS98 Sawback Bayonet with Leather Grips, Leather Scabbard and Acceptance Marked Spine




German KS98 Bayonets ~ Issue Erfurt Sawback with Wooden Grip Panels ~ Private Purchase Sawback with Leather Grips ~ Private Purchase Plane Blade Walking-Out with Wooden Grip Panels

 

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Discussion Starter · #10 · (Edited)
German S1898/02 Mauser Sawback Bayonet




German S1898/05 Mauser Bayonets


German S1898/05 a-A Bayonet with Standard Issue Leather Scabbard

PHOTOS PENDING


German S1898/05 n-A Bayonet with Flash-guard and Standard Issue Steel Scabbard





German S1898/05 n-A Variations with Flash-guard ~ Standard ~ Sawback ~ Sawback Removed




German S1888/98/05 Mauser Bayonet



Carter struggled with the classification of this rare and unusual bayonet that is either an extremely well made ersatz bayonet or a poor quality extreme variation of the standard S98/05 bayonet.


German S1869/98 Mauser Bayonet

Converted from a Bavarian M1869 Werder Bayonet




German A-S1871/98 Mauser Bayonet

Converted from a S1871 Bayonet that was originally converted for the M1871 Mauser from the S1860 Fusilier Bayonet, it was intended for issue to the field artillery



 

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Discussion Starter · #11 · (Edited)
Foreign Bayonets Requisitioned or Purchased/Captured and Converted to fit German Rifles

German Requisitioned Siamese or Chinese Contract M1907 Bayonet

While the frog stud on the scabbard is similar to those seen on Turkish bayonets, it is original to this model.




German Issue French Mle 1866 Chassepot Bayonets captured during the Franco-Prussian War

Mle 1866 Chassepot Bayonet issued unaltered as a Sidearm with replaced German style frog stud



German issue Mle 1866 Chassepot Bayonets ~ Unaltered ~ Middle two examples Converted to fit the M1871 & M1871/84 Mausers ~ Converted to fit the M71, M71/84 Mausers and M1888 Commission Rifle




German Issue French Mle 1874 Gras Bayonets

German issue Mle 1874 Gras Bayonets ~ Three variations of the multitude of different conversions to fit the Gew 88 and/or the M71 & M71/84 Rifles ~ Conversion to fit the Gew 98 Rifle




German Captured and Re-issued Russian M1891 Three-Line Rifle Bayonet

Unaltered captured Russian M1891 Bayonets as issued with captured Russian rifle in German manufactured zinc scabbards



 

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Discussion Starter · #12 · (Edited)
German Wartime Manufactured S1914 Bayonets


German S1914 Bayonets - Version I Standard Pattern

German S14 Bayonets - Version I ~ Sawback with flash-guard for the Kar 98 ~ Bottom two examples without flash-guard for issue with the Gew 98




German S14 Bayonets - Version II "Gottscho" Pattern

German S14 Bayonets - Version II ~ Top two examples are standard issue ~ The bottom example is the rare Sawback version











German Issue S14 - Type III - Greek M1903 Mannlicher-Schoenauer Bayonet

German issue S14 - Type III converted from the M1903 Mannlicher-Schoenauer Bayonet ~ Top example unaltered for comparison ~ Bottom two Conversions for the Gew 98.

 

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Discussion Starter · #13 · (Edited)
German Wartime Manufactured ersatz Bayonets

The identification system used with the following photos is based on the widely acknowledged classifications applied to the landmark study of German bayonets authored by Anthony Carter. Each reference number is generally proceeded by "EB" which is simply an abbreviation of Ersatz Bayonet. While a number of different major works on German bayonets have been published since Carter's 1992 revised "German Bayonets: Volume III" or the shorter publication first published in 1976, "German Ersatz Bayonets: 1. A concise illustrated history of the emergency all-metal designs, 1914-18", Carter's work is far more widespread based on the decades that his work has been available to Collectors.

I will include space in this thread for examples that are not currently included in my Collection in the hope of adding the appropriate photos at a later date, i.e. after acquiring the additional bayonets. Fingers crossed!!! I will also have to go back through the Collection as well to review every bayonet since the photos I am posting here never included 100% of the ersatz bayonets in the Collection.

Combination Trench-Knife Bayonets

EB1




Known among collectors as the Crank-Handle Bayonet for obvious reasons. Better photo pending. These first two photos have been edited out of a larger series of photos of my Trench Knife Collection. Better photo pending.


EB2





Standard Issue ersatz Bayonets

EB3



EB4



EB5


Same as above without fuller

EB6

Manufactured with pre-WWI Belgian Blade

EB7

Cleaning hole passes through the hilt

EB8

Same as above without fuller

EB9



EB10


Same as above without fuller

EB11


Similar to above with less pronounced pommel

EB12

Same as above with shallow fuller
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 · (Edited)
German Wartime Manufactured ersatz Bayonets Continued.......


EB13

Same as above with shallow fuller and no pommel beak

EB14 - EB19

These bayonets are variations of the above with the open muzzle ring removed

EB20

An ultra-rare example, similar to those above, with the addition of a tube added to the muzzle ring to help support a side mounted bayonet lug welded to the original nose-cap of captured Russian M1891 Three-Line Rifles

EB21



EB22

Same as above with the muzzle ring removed

EB23





EB23 variant with copper flashed grip

EB24

Same as above without fuller

EB25

Same as EB23 with muzzle ring removed

EB26

Same as EB23 with cleaning hole below muzzle ring and fullered blade

EB27

Same as above without fuller

EB28





Similar to EB23 with raised platform surrounding the press catch with fuller

EB29

Same as above without fuller

EB30


Same as above with or without fuller, with the muzzle ring removed
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
German Wartime Manufactured ersatz Bayonets Continued.......


EB31

Removed from the original list in the 1992 revised Edition of Volume III

EB32



For the Gew 98 only

EB33

Same as above without fuller

EB34

Photo pending with fuller

EB35

Same as above without fuller

EB36



EB37

Same as above without fuller

EB38



EB39



EB40

Same as above with narrow machined fuller

EB41



EB42



EB43

Same as EB41 above with narrow machined fullers

EB44

Same as EB41 above with narrower blade and more narrow machined fullers

EB45



EB46

Same as above with muzzle ring removed

EB47



EB48

Same as above with muzzle ring removed

EB49



EB50

Same as above without fuller
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 · (Edited)
German Wartime Manufactured ersatz Bayonets Continued.......

EB51


Same as EB50 above, but with a cast brass grip

EB52

Moved to ersatz socket bladed section in Vol III

EB53



EB53 incorporates this grip and crossguard with a standard 11" to 12" fullered blade

EB54




Example with fuller





Example without fuller

For issue with captured and reissued Russian M1891 Three-Line Rifles

EB55






This very rare ersatz model is rarer still based on the unit mark, "2 E 55 2 K 11" on the crossguard. Most ersatz bayonets were produced after unit markings had been discontinued.

Of particular interest is the same regimental marking appears in the list of unit marked ersatz bayonets in Jeff Noll's excellent work, "The Imperial German Regimental Marking: Revised Edition."


On page 141 EB4 pattern ersatz bayonets are listed as marked, "2.E.55.2.K 5.7" which translates as "Infanterie-Regiment 55, Ersatz-Bataillon 2, Kompagnie 2 & Kompagnie 5, Waffe Nr. 7". The EB55 bayonet shown above was issued as weapon 11 in the 2nd Company of the same regiment.

I'm going to assume that Jeff's recording of
"Kompagnie 2 & Kompagnie 5" indicates that he recorded two separate bayonets unit marked to the same regiment and battalion that in turn were individually marked, one to the 2nd Company and the other to the 5th Company. If this is the case, then it would be purely coincidental that they both happened to be Weapon #7?

EB56



EB57

Withdrawn in Vol III

EB58



This bayonet was produced for issue with captured and reissued Belgian M1889 Mausers. This ersatz model was manufactured to fill the 6% to 7%
sawback requirement that were issued to each regiment. The balance of soldiers were issued captured Belgian M89 bayonets.

EB59-60



This extremely rare bayonet is one of a variety of ersatz bayonets produced by Native smiths in the African bush for issue with M1871 Jaeger Rifles originally issued to the African Askaris of the Schutztruppe serving under the command of von Lettow-Vorbeck during the campaigns in colonial Africa. No two surviving examples are exactly the same, though they all feature the simple but ingenious locking swivel on the pommel of the crude grip.

EB61-66

All are extremely rare and unlikely to be encountered, featuring recognizable ersatz pattern grips with long 19th Century Foreign blades that range from the French Mle 1874 Gras and Mle 1866 Chassepot blades, to the Italian M1870 Vetterli blade to variations of the Austro-Hungarian M67, M70 and M73 blades. While I have seen some of these bayonets in European Museum collections, I have never been personally fortunate enough to stumble across one for sale!
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 · (Edited)
German Wartime Manufactured ersatz Bayonets Continued.......


EB67-EB81

This final segment of Carter's work on the German issue ersatz bayonets of WWI is the final section of this presentation, as well as the one area in which I will cast the EB identification system to the wind. EB67 through EB81 represent steel or brass gripped ersatz bayonets that utilize obsolete socket bayonet blades rather than the more typical 11" to 12" knife style blades that are common to the majority of the bayonets above.

There are two primary reasons for this deviation from his ID system.

1) The wide variety of socket bayonet blades utilized in the construction of these bayonets make some of them extremely difficult and tedious to identify. Some of the Austro-Hungarian blades stand out as do some of the English blades. Others are unmarked other than the Imperial German acceptance marks and require extensive measurements and research to determine the original source of the blade. My knowledge of 18th and 19th Century socket bayonets is not extensive enough to lure me into trying to identify each and every blade that was utilized to produce the 30 examples in my Collection.

2) Whereas these bayonets were extremely rare and hard to come by when Carter performed his research and published his landmark work noted above, it has since been determined where the bulk of these bayonets ended up following WWI. When U.S., British and Nato troops starting returning from their initial deployments in Afghanistan, fairly sizable numbers of these German ersatz bayonets returned to the West in duffle bags. That these unusual bayonets came to light in Afghan bizarre's was somewhat surprising, but not entirely shocking either.

In an effort to help keep Ottoman Turkey in the war, in order to continue to tie down as many Russian and Entente divisions as possible, Germany supplied large amounts of ordnance, rifles, bayonets and equipment to the beleaguered Turkish Army. The German high command had long come to the conclusion that a decisive victory could only be won on the Western Front.

Among the Gew 88s, Gew 98s and Kar 98s that were supplied to Turkey, a large percentage of the bayonets shipped with them were ersatz models that had been withdrawn from German units when adequate supplies of standard S98-05s and S84-98s bayonets were being manufactured on a regular basis to meet monthly requirements. After the war, Turkey made an interesting attempt to "standardize" the myriad of different ersatz bayonets through various alterations among which was a shortening of the blades. When these bayonets were imported into the U.S. in large quantities, there was a near total absence of bayonets built with socket blades. Obviously the Turks sold them off as surplus in the Middle East.

While still not "common" these bayonets arrived in western militaria markets in large enough quantities that include variations that Carter had never seen, recorded or published in his work. Based on the assumption that the sudden influx of these bayonets on the market was not going to last forever, I struck deals with a number of returning U.S. Soldiers and purchased multiple lots at discount prices. Prior to the Afghan War, I had a single example in the Collection. The other 29, nearly all of which include their original scabbards, were acquired in this manner.

Instead of trying to match the variations to Carter's identification system, I will instead post this section based on the design of the ersatz grips rather than by the obsolete socket blade of each bayonet. The method of manufacture for each pattern was based on cutting the blade from it's original socket next to the muzzle sleeve. The long solid section composed of the elbow was then straightened and forged flat, then machined to create the blade tang that the grips, cross-guard and pommel are riveted to.

I will try to present different blade variations whenever possible, that are present within each group with identical grip construction.


One final comment regarding one of my "pet peeves".......I've never been overly fond of acronyms. This one is no exception. The common reference today is to refer to these as "ERSOC" bayonets, which is short for ERsatz SOCket bayonets. Bugs the hell out of me!!! ;>)


Brass Gripped ersatz Bayonet with Socket Blade




Artillerie-Depot at Altona Style Grip







A number of ersatz bayonets featuring this grip, cross-guard and pommel are marked with various abbreviations of the German Artillery Depot at Altona. Part of the IX Armeekorps, Altona was a port on the Elbe River in what today would be Hamburg. The blades of both of these examples appear to be from Austro-Hungarian M1867 Socket Bayonets.


Parallel-Grip Small Pommel Peak



This example above features the blade of an obsolete Austro-Hungarian M1854 Lorenz Bayonet







More to follow........

Warmest regards,

JPS


 

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Discussion Starter · #18 · (Edited)
I have completed a long photo session to record 100% of the remaining German ersatz bayonets in my Collection. This includes the various features of socket bayonet blades mated to typical pattern ersatz grips and crossguards. The remaining bayonets represent a broad cross section of ersatz models that were manufactured with blades from obsolete socket bayonets.

The following photos have been taken based on paring up the remaining ersatz bayonets with socket blades.

Please note that among the groups of German ersatz bayonets represented in these additional photos, even within a small cross section of serial production, there are common examples of ersatz grips that were mated to a wide variety of obsolete socket bayonet blades.



This rare example was never recorded by Carter during his research for his excellent landmark work on Imperial German Bayonets. This example consists of one of the most common of the ersatz bayonet grips, the EB3, which in this case has been matched to a captured Mle 1886 Lebel bayonet.






The unit mark applied to this bayonet is as rare and interesting as the bayonet itself! Our best efforts, supported by Jeff Noll's excellent work: "
The marking, "E.B.L.I.R." to the best of our knowledge, reads "Ersatz Bataillon Landwehr Infantry Regiment."
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 · (Edited)
All of the following ersatz bayonets feature the same pattern grip and crossguard, which is the same as EB49 above, however many of the obsolete socket bayonet blades below are from a variety of different models. In addition to the variety of blades, there are also a broad cross section of different patterns of zinc scabbards that accompany these bayonets.











 

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Discussion Starter · #20 · (Edited)
The following bayonets were produced with the same grip and crossguard as the EB36 pictured above. The majority of the obsolete socket bayonet blades that are generally matched with this grip come from the British P53 bayonet, however, a quick scan of the photos below will indeed confirm that other blades were used with this grip design. It is also interesting to note that the length of the blades vary tremendously from one example to the next.








 
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