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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
My neighbor offered me an SA marked Carcano. It is all matching, but the stock has been sanded and there is rust pitting on the front sight. How rare is a Finn capture Carcano? Where were they "captured"?

Thanks in advance.
 

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'Capture' isn't the operative word here... the Finns actually bought these from the Italians during their winter war with Russia. I'm not sure of the precise number Finland bought - I believe it was over 90,000.


If the stock has been sanded, don't dig into the wallet too deeply for it - these show up regularly on the auction sites. SW
 

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More info from an old 1/05 post

Italian Firearms Forum
7.35MM SA marked Carcano

Andy Gordon
Gunboards Super Premium Member



USA
336 Posts
Posted - 01/06/2005 : 5:17:48 PM
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This TS was made in 1939. Its Finnish marked "SA".
Are these rare? Thankyou, Andy




Download Attachment:
91.62 KB
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Andy Gordon

DMala
Gunboards.Com Silver Star Member



USA
570 Posts
Posted - 01/07/2005 : 2:01:36 PM
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Dear Andy, it is not a TS (Truppe Speciali) carbine, it is a Mod. 38 Short Rifle.

Anyhow, your sample is nice, but rather common. Enjoy it!

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DMala



"Spero che la mia brigata viva per sempre nei nostri cuori, e che vaga in mona chi l'ha sciolta" (from the brigatacadore.it website).


Andy Gordon
Gunboards Super Premium Member



USA
336 Posts
Posted - 01/07/2005 : 2:55:24 PM
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Why does it say "TS" on the stock?
Im confused about this rifle?
Andy

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Andy Gordon


Douglas I. Kerley
Gunboards.Com Silver Star Member



USA
953 Posts
Posted - 01/07/2005 : 5:31:42 PM
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HI; looks like some morons work after. Doug


keithreid
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



USA
2410 Posts
Posted - 01/20/2005 : 4:49:25 PM
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maybe not so rare. i've found 2 in pawnshops in the last 3 weeks. i've been looking for one because i've been collecting finn rifles and it would fit in. the first one was 90 bucks otd but the lady wouldn't sell it to me because she was SURE she couldn't sell a rifle to anyone but a tennessee resident. the second one had the stock cut down and BEEEEUTIFULLY engraved. yuck! i'll find one someday i guess. looks like a nice rifle, ammo sure is hard to come by for em though. y'all have a nice day, Keith
were they all made in 1939? the two i found were the same year.

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COA#104114
looking for the following finn m91's:
tikka with s/n below 130(25 tikka)
44vkt(referenced in lapin's book)
finned chattelerault m91


Keith A. Reid

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Edited by - keithreid on 01/20/2005 4:50:04 PM


qvekid
Gunboards Super Premium Member



USA
492 Posts
Posted - 01/21/2005 : 10:48:21 AM
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they are less common than standard carcanos,they where military aid given to finland buy the italian goverment of mussolini to fight the comunist goverment of the u.s.s.r.


Atlpete
Gunboards Premium Member



USA
165 Posts
Posted - 01/21/2005 : 5:32:45 PM
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Hey Andy, I can't see the TS on the stock from your jpg but since it looks like your serial begins with a 'U' I'd guess it is some kind of builder(Terni)or inspector, arsennel or supplier's proof stamp.


Andy Gordon
Gunboards Super Premium Member



USA
336 Posts
Posted - 01/22/2005 : 08:30:28 AM
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9th pic down, Pete, enlarge it...TS
Andy

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Andy Gordon


Atlpete
Gunboards Premium Member



USA
165 Posts
Posted - 01/22/2005 : 11:52:58 AM
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Oh okay, sure enough; it almost looks like it's printed in ink as opposed to a cartouche? Never seen this specific marking before, just speculating but perhaps it aquired the mark in SA service? Maybe the Finn-o-philes would recognize it.


qvekid
Gunboards Super Premium Member



USA
492 Posts
Posted - 01/28/2005 : 11:59:14 PM
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i think it it is a lot less common than a carcano without the S.A.mark i would keep it.


NebrHogger
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



USA
1943 Posts
Posted - 01/30/2005 : 2:25:25 PM
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This thread brings up an interesting question: Were the majority of the M38s in 7.35 sold/sent to Finland? I'm only talking about M38s & not cav carbines or TS. SW

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If you got to shoot, Shoot! Don't talk!


airdale
Gunboards.Com Silver Star Member



USA
933 Posts
Posted - 01/30/2005 : 5:33:24 PM
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Neb, my Carcano book says about 285,000 M38 short rifles were produced with Terni being the largest manufacturer making approx. 260,000 of these. Finland recieved about 94,500 with slings, folding bayonets and ammo.
I wonder what happened with all the cleaning rods? I rarely see a Carcano with a cleaning rod.


NebrHogger
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



USA
1943 Posts
Posted - 01/30/2005 : 5:40:00 PM
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I've been looking all over for a folding bayonet, too. Preferably one onder 100 bucks. I read on a site that "most" wound up in Finland, but it's always well to look further before buying into a statement like that. Thanks for the reply! SW

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If you got to shoot, Shoot! Don't talk!


Franchi
Gunboards Super Premium Member



USA
368 Posts
Posted - 02/07/2005 : 12:49:05 PM
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Andy, I would like to add my .02¢ worth.
All [SA] marked Model 38 short rifles were made by R.E. Terni.
There are [SA] examples dated 1938, 1939, and 1940.
The [SA] examples are more common, in the U.S., than non [SA] rifles (a bunch were imported from Finland) The non [SA] examples were brought back from WWII and are harder to find.

The "T.S." on your rifles butt is probably the initials of a previous owner.

The front sight hasn't been changed to the Finnish style, the Finns changed the front sights on many, some retain their original Italian sights.

The standard (not the "latch-lock") Italian "folding" bayonet isn't that uncommon ($50 to $100), the Finnish [SA] marked example is rare and costs about 3 times more. Watch out for a standard Italian bayonet with an Italian inspector [SA] marking, these are sometimes sold as Finnish issue. The Finnish [SA] is larger and a different style than the Italian inspector [SA].

David Franchi


qvekid
Gunboards Super Premium Member



USA
492 Posts
Posted - 02/10/2005 : 11:10:41 PM
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to me an SA marked gun would be a lot more disireable miltary aide from italiy to finland to fight the communist hoards


Andy Gordon
Gunboards Super Premium Member



USA
336 Posts
Posted - 02/11/2005 : 07:38:49 AM
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No wonder my Italian folder wont fit. Why didnt the Finns change this ones sight?
Its still WW2 history. Andy

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Andy Gordon


Gil Martin
Gunboards Member



USA
17 Posts
Posted - 02/18/2005 : 8:26:04 PM
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I picked up an SA-marked 1938 in 7.35mm in a local gun shop. The hang tag price was $100, but I got it for $80. It is an interesting addition to my collection. All the best...
Gil

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Gil Martin


Franchi
Gunboards Super Premium Member



USA
368 Posts
Posted - 02/21/2005 : 7:13:21 PM
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Andy, The bayonet should fit with either front sight. Don't know why all rifles didn't have the Finnish front sight, could be they only changed the sight on the rifles they actually used, the others were put in storage?
From examples I have seen about 70% have a Finnish sight.
David


qvekid
Gunboards Super Premium Member



USA
492 Posts
Posted - 02/26/2005 : 8:29:48 PM
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gil you can not beat a high powered world war 2 for $80,00 great buy


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http://old.gunboards.com/topicasp?TOPIC_ID=81655
 

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SA marked rifle

I agree with the previous posts that the SA (Finnish) markings would add to the value of the rifle. It would for me at any rate.

Prices are going up on World War II era rifles and I'd be willing to bet that your SA marked short rifle (or TS carbine?) will gain value faster than most investment funds. Good luck.
 

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Interestingly, most of the M38 short rifles on the market are Finnish issue (SA marked) and it is much more difficult to find a M38 that did NOT go to Finland.
 

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Agree. I have only seen one in person & I bought it. SW
 
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