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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have seen a few of the late Rumanian (ROU, Romania) refurbs around, but at some pretty inflated prices (IMO). By late refurb, I refer to the VZ24's that have all metal blued, scrubbed crests, all matching SN's (but electro-penciled SN on bolt), "R" prefix generally somewhere in the SN, and are generally in pretty nice condition. (In an older thread, there was some discussion as to whether these were Russian refurbed VZ24's, although enough points were made in that thread against that assumption for me to believe that they are Romanian.)

I have a few various VZ24's, and a number of ROU VZ24's to make my collection interesting, and have been thinking of adding one of these later refurb versions, just because they are in nice condition, and they look a little different from my earlier ROU refurbs.

This one recently sold for $625.00. Granted, it's a 1940 crest, and is in great shape, but that seems a bit high for what it is. Similar condition rifles are seen (with partially scrubbed KC or Lion crest) with $500.00 asking prices.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=479973119

Here is another VZ24 that also sold for $625.00, and also appears to be ROU refurb, but Crest markings and SN indicate otherwise. (1931 Czech Army acceptance stamp.) What would the story be on this gun? Given to Romania by Germans "outside" of Romania contract, and refurbed later?
:confused:

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=467018204

So is this just irrational exuberance on behalf of the Buyer, and high expectations on behalf of the Seller, or am I missing something here? What do you consider a current fair price for one of these rifles in G-VG condition, with completely scrubbed crest and all matching SN's?

Am curious to hear any and all opinions and observations.

Best,
Roger
 

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Here is another VZ24 that also sold for $625.00, and also appears to be ROU refurb, but Crest markings and SN indicate otherwise. (1931 Czech Army acceptance stamp.) What would the story be on this gun? Given to Romania by Germans "outside" of Romania contract, and refurbed later?
:confused:

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=467018204
This one was accepted by the Czechoslovak Army in 1931 and used by them. Later it would have been taken by the Germans and used by them. I would guess that in the upheaval at the end of WWII it found its way to Romania.

It has the signature Romainian rebuild stacking rod (instead of a cleaning rod), a Romanian CM marked bolt, and a new Romanian stock with sloppy s/n and signature stain markings by the buttplate. There is no doubt that it is a Romanian rebuild. The serial numbers may be the same but they are not "matching"; they need to be original to be matching.

My opinion is that these sell for more than they are worth because they are pretty (as opposed to original) guns. I have two of them but only because I wanted the crests.
 

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I think these were going for around $250 when they came into the country some years ago, so a fair price might be $400 now, provided the rifle is still in the grease. There were 2 different types of refurb, one with new stocks and the other used stocks but new handguards. They might have come from different countries. There were other differences, but I'm too lazy to go look at my pair. They are "pretty", I'll say that.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Bill,

Thank you very much for the clarification on that particular gun. And it just dawned on me how much of a dolt I am. Did a little digging and pulled up this old thread IRT the stacking rod vs the cleaning rod, in which you talk about them. Don't know where my head has been, but I've been buying cleaning rods to "complete" my ROU refurb's that didn't have them. (Older refurbs, with stamped same (not matching) SN's on bolt, and not reblued like later batches.) Granted, they are refurbs, so "correct" is probably not the way to describe them....but should I have just left them alone? Did Romanians supply stacking rods for ALL their VZ24 refurbs, or only the later ones? Were the early ones provided with either a cleaning rod OR a stacking rod, or only a stacking rod? Should I be looking for stacking rods instead of cleaning rods to put in my ROU VZ24 refurbs? Heck, I guess what I want to know is if there is anything wrong with putting VZ24 cleaning rods in ROU VZ24 refurbs that were acquired without the cleaning or stacking rod? Looking forward to your views, as I know you'll not pull your punches. :)

Best,
Roger

http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?346418-vz-24-SR-prefix
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I think these were going for around $250 when they came into the country some years ago, so a fair price might be $400 now, provided the rifle is still in the grease. There were 2 different types of refurb, one with new stocks and the other used stocks but new handguards. They might have come from different countries. There were other differences, but I'm too lazy to go look at my pair. They are "pretty", I'll say that.
Thank you, Sir! Funny what you said about the stocks. One I saw recently was the opposite of that, i.e., the stock is new, but the handguard looks old. They are pretty. So, if not still in the grease, I'll assume that $350 or so is fair for one of these in decent shape?

Best,
Roger
 

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Bill,

Thank you very much for the clarification on that particular gun. And it just dawned on me how much of a dolt I am. Did a little digging and pulled up this old thread IRT the stacking rod vs the cleaning rod, in which you talk about them. Don't know where my head has been, but I've been buying cleaning rods to "complete" my ROU refurb's that didn't have them. (Older refurbs, with stamped same (not matching) SN's on bolt, and not reblued like later batches.) Granted, they are refurbs, so "correct" is probably not the way to describe them....but should I have just left them alone? Did Romanians supply stacking rods for ALL their VZ24 refurbs, or only the later ones? Were the early ones provided with either a cleaning rod OR a stacking rod, or only a stacking rod? Should I be looking for stacking rods instead of cleaning rods to put in my ROU VZ24 refurbs? Heck, I guess what I want to know is if there is anything wrong with putting VZ24 cleaning rods in ROU VZ24 refurbs that were acquired without the cleaning or stacking rod? Looking forward to your views, as I know you'll not pull your punches. :)

Best,
Roger

http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?346418-vz-24-SR-prefix
Curmudgeons never pull punches.

The cleaning rod seems to be the first thing lost from a rifle in service. I like all of my rifles to have correct cleaning rods and buy them as necessary. As for the Romanian "stacking rod" -- I don't really know -- but here is my guess: I have only seen this kind of rod on Romanian refurbs and not all of them. I think they used a normal cleaning rod if they had one. If the cleaning rod was missing they used a quick-and-easy-to-manufacture stacking rod. I call it a "stacking rod" because the tiny hole is useless for cleaning; it is there only to unscrew the rod. If not used for cleaning, the only purpose for the rod is to enable stacking weapons. It had no threads on the front end to join rods.

My only Romanian stacking rod came in my King Carol crest rifle. It has a new stock and handguard, and I am leaving the stacking rod in it as appropriate for a refurb.

Mausers in the field were usually cleaned with pull-throughs. In the barracks they may have had full length rods. The (short) cleaning rods were included with the rifles because cleaning after using corrosive ammo was so important. If you had no other cleaning equipment available, you could at least join rods from multiple rifles and run a water soaked scrap of fabric through the bore, then follow that with oil if you had any.

As for stocks and handguards, I think the Romanian refurbs got what they needed: sometimes a new stock, sometimes a new handguard, and sometimes both.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
The cleaning rod seems to be the first thing lost from a rifle in service. I like all of my rifles to have correct cleaning rods and buy them as necessary. As for the Romanian "stacking rod" -- I don't really know -- but here is my guess: I have only seen this kind of rod on Romanian refurbs and not all of them. I think they used a normal cleaning rod if they had one. If the cleaning rod was missing they used a quick-and-easy-to-manufacture stacking rod. I call it a "stacking rod" because the tiny hole is useless for cleaning; it is there only to unscrew the rod. If not used for cleaning, the only purpose for the rod is to enable stacking weapons. It had no threads on the front end to join rods.

My only Romanian stacking rod came in my King Carol crest rifle. It has a new stock and handguard, and I am leaving the stacking rod in it as appropriate for a refurb.

As for stocks and handguards, I think the Romanian refurbs got what they needed: sometimes a new stock, sometimes a new handguard, and sometimes both.
Thank you very much, Bill! I will drive on with getting cleaning rods for those rifles I have that don't have them. (I always go with "originals" vs the reproductions, when I can find them.) OTOH, do you know of any source for the "stacking" rods for the late ROU VZ24 refurbs? I have never seen any for sale on any of the various sites that carry such things, or on Ebay for that matter.

Thanks again,
Roger
 

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I think the ones with the mixed new/used stock/handguard combos were Yugo 24/47s.
M24/47 rifles may have had that, but the subject here is Romanians, not Yugos.
 

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the Romanian refurbs have nice new stocks, generally very good or better barrels. I have bought (and then sold later ) a couple of them after shooting them for well under $200.00. They are the equivalent of the Mosin nagant 91/30's refurbished and Russian capture k-98's that are still around. History has been erased. shoot and enjoy them until you wear out the barrel!
gil
 

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I think these were going for around $250 when they came into the country some years ago, so a fair price might be $400 now, provided the rifle is still in the grease. There were 2 different types of refurb, one with new stocks and the other used stocks but new handguards. They might have come from different countries. There were other differences, but I'm too lazy to go look at my pair. They are "pretty", I'll say that.
You guys pay extra for grease?? First thing I remove!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
You guys pay extra for grease?? First thing I remove!!
Hah! Well put, but I think poster may have been referring to still unused/unfired by owner who removed grease. :)

I may have overpaid. Picked up a late refurb' for $299.00, and had forgotten that I already had a nice example that I paid $250 for a couple years ago. But short of missing it's cleaning/stacking rod, it appears new as refurbed (sans grease). I guess I can live with that, and now I have two.

Best,
Roger

Czech VZ-24 (ROU) late Refurb - 2.jpg Czech VZ-24 (ROU) late Refurb - 3.jpg Czech VZ-24 (ROU) late Refurb - 4.jpg Czech VZ-24 (ROU) late Refurb - 5.jpg Czech VZ-24 (ROU) late Refurb - 6.jpg Czech VZ-24 (ROU) late Refurb - 10.jpg Czech VZ-24 (ROU) late Refurb - 18.jpg Czech VZ-24 (ROU) late Refurb - 20.jpg
 
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