CG63 Ammo and Reloading
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Was looking to get a nice rifle to try shooting with aperture sights and found the CG63. Then I found that I could add aperture sights to my Tikka T3 Light 6.5x55 and dropped the idea of getting a CG63. Then I got to thinking...
My T3 has a 22' barrel and the CG63 has a 29" barrel. Not sure how accurate used CG63 is but my T3 is very accurate with a scope. Would there be much of an advantage to having the extra 7" of barrel to increase the sight radius? My AK has a short sight radius and it does well to 300+ yards with iron sights.
Which would be better for iron sight shooting, a shorter accurate rifle or a surplus rifle with longer sight radius? Just looking for a different way to do some plinking.
My T3 has a 22' barrel and the CG63 has a 29" barrel. Not sure how accurate used CG63 is but my T3 is very accurate with a scope. Would there be much of an advantage to having the extra 7" of barrel to increase the sight radius? My AK has a short sight radius and it does well to 300+ yards with iron sights.
Which would be better for iron sight shooting, a shorter accurate rifle or a surplus rifle with longer sight radius? Just looking for a different way to do some plinking.
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CG 63s were made in calibers other than 6.5X55. They include 7X57, 8X57, and 7.62NATO(308Win). So I guess don't load hotter than 52KCUP(62,000psi).
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A CG63 is not really a "surplus" rifle. It's a match grade target rifle built on a surplus receiver with a new production (at time of conversion) heavy target barrel. There are plenty of people who know a lot more about this rifle than I do, but, as with any old rifle, accuracy is dependent in large part on bore condition. There are plenty of CG63s out there with excellent bores that will go round for round with a modern Tikka or Sako. The length of the sight radius definitely affects accuracy. I don't think you can compare a CG63 to a "modern" sporting rifle like a Tikka T3. They're just two different animals. I have a CG63 that was built on a 1917 Carl Gustafs receiver and converted by Carl Guatafs in 1965. The bore is mint and it will put rounds on a target that touch at 100 yards. It's by far one of my favorite rifles in my collection.
Big Question, are the CG63's left hand friendly? I only shoot iron sights with left eye. Just started shooting left handed few years ago when I found out I can see the sights with my left eye.
I already am setup for 6.5x55 but have always wanted a 8x57? Can the 8x57 shoot surplus ammo that is on the market right now?
I read somewhere that there are new replacement barrels for the 6.5x55 that are somewhat cost effective (maybe old news) but what about the 8x57 (if for some reason you get one thats not a good shooter)?
The CG63 is getting more interesting and now I am thinking I need to have one instead of fitting my T3 with a aperture sight. Thanks for the info.
I already am setup for 6.5x55 but have always wanted a 8x57? Can the 8x57 shoot surplus ammo that is on the market right now?
I read somewhere that there are new replacement barrels for the 6.5x55 that are somewhat cost effective (maybe old news) but what about the 8x57 (if for some reason you get one thats not a good shooter)?
The CG63 is getting more interesting and now I am thinking I need to have one instead of fitting my T3 with a aperture sight. Thanks for the info.
Is the rifle left hand shooter friendly?
Are the Lothar Walther 6.5x55 M96 barrels going to be the same diameter as the CG63 barrles?
Would the barrel be "home gunsmith" friendly? Would you be able to swap the barrel out with a barrel vise like the ones from Midway or would there be some gunsmithing work required to get to barrel installed?
Are the Lothar Walther 6.5x55 M96 barrels going to be the same diameter as the CG63 barrles?
Would the barrel be "home gunsmith" friendly? Would you be able to swap the barrel out with a barrel vise like the ones from Midway or would there be some gunsmithing work required to get to barrel installed?
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The CG80 addressed the left hand problem with a bolt handle bent up & swept back , so the lefty could reach over the rifle & grab the bolt a little easier than a straight bolt . However , no such feature on the CG63's . Numrich has the left type bolts for a CG80 , which can be used on the CG63 , if you want to swap out the bolt . Lothar-Walther has CG63 barrels with the same profile as original CG barrels . At least that is what I have heard . The CG63 barrel is 29" long and the rear is 28m/m ( 1.102" ) in diameter . CG80 barrels are 32m/m ( about 1.250" ) at the rear , but L-W does not make them . I do not know if the L-W barrels are short chambered for finish reaming after the barrel is installed ? I suspect you can replace the barrel if you know what you are doing ? I don't know that a Midway barrel vise would fit the CG63 barrel , at 28m/m ?????????
As much as I like Swedish Mausers, the Tikka T3 is magnitudes a better rifle. I can easily load 140gr rounds to 3000 fps if I want to burn the barrel faster. I keep it at the 2600 because I am not good enough yet to need such high velocity and I want the barrel to last longer.
I have had multiple M96s, 1 CG 63 but all I have left now is a CG80. But even compared to that the T3 is so much better.
Ultimately the best rifle for you would be which do you enjoy more: shooting as accurate as you can, shooting accurate and competing, or enjoying a classic rifle for fun?
Me, I got bit by the competition bug so most of my surplus rifles went away to make $ for accurate rifles. If you want to compete and have a chance of winning, unfortunately you can't do it with the Swedish Mauser target rifles.
If I get more competitive in silhouette matches, a T3 Lite in 6.5x55 is what I am looking at to compete with.
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I have had multiple M96s, 1 CG 63 but all I have left now is a CG80. But even compared to that the T3 is so much better.
If for purely iron sight shooting, the T3 will have more potential even with the shorter sight radius. You can extend the sight radius for $80 with a bloop tube (as I did in my Sporter below). The only thing the CG63 and CG80 have that is better compared to a T3 Lite is the stock, which is made for prone target shooting whereas the T3 Lite is not. The only other thing I can see the advantage being with the CG63 is the possible cheaper price (possible to get less than $600 with sights) on a shooter grade and its already done.landtoy80 said:
Ultimately the best rifle for you would be which do you enjoy more: shooting as accurate as you can, shooting accurate and competing, or enjoying a classic rifle for fun?
Me, I got bit by the competition bug so most of my surplus rifles went away to make $ for accurate rifles. If you want to compete and have a chance of winning, unfortunately you can't do it with the Swedish Mauser target rifles.
If I get more competitive in silhouette matches, a T3 Lite in 6.5x55 is what I am looking at to compete with.
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Tell that to the guys at the NRA long range matches (800 to 1000 yards). Speed buys you windage points, the faster the bullet gets to the target, the less time wind (and less wind even because of lower elevation) will have a chance to affect the trajectory. I am not into it, but there are people in F-class (prone rifle on a front and rear rest) that have less than 3 inch groups at 1000 yards.
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Thauglor : You are talking about an entirely different class of weapon . The Swedish Mauser is no comparison to a bench rest rifle !!!!!!!!!! So , not a topic that is relevant to this forum . Swedish mausers are consistently winning military matches in the USA . That is the subject matter on this forum . Swedish mauser target rifles are also a topic on this forum , but still not in the bench rest rifle class . We stress safety when shooting Swedish mausers . No hot loads !!!!!!!!!!!!
Swede, I agree 100%, even more so on not doing hot loads through the Swedish Mausers. I also agree the Swedes will win or be close to winning in military rifle matches.
Landtoy80 asked for accuracy and if he is going to compete in the match rifle category, there are better options. On that note I use my CG 80 for midrange (300 to 600 yard prone) matches because it's fun but I don't expect to win it.
Landtoy80 asked for accuracy and if he is going to compete in the match rifle category, there are better options. On that note I use my CG 80 for midrange (300 to 600 yard prone) matches because it's fun but I don't expect to win it.
I do like shooting my shorter barrel T3 but there is something about shooting a rifle with a longer barrel. It must be a male thing
Putting a bloop tube on my T3 might give me the feel of a longer barrel but it might be like having a penile extension... (guess I wont be buying a bloop tube now)
I am just looking to have a fun plinker that does shoot well. The only thing I dont like about buying surplus/used is its usually a crap shoot weather its a good one or a bad one. I am no expert when it comes to judging a surplus/used ffirearm. You dont know till you get to the range. My M91/30 barrel looked good but the bore turned out to be .315". When first shooting it, it patterned like a shotgun. After much work shims and finding a good load that will work with the oversize barrel it turned out to be a good shooter.
The only thing I read that worries me is I found some info that said some of the CG63 have been rebarreled several times and the stretching of the receiver has made them unsafe or prone to fail. Something about setting the barrel back each time it has a new barrel attached??? Not sure if what I read is correct. Is there a way to tell if the receiver has stretched and is going to fail from too many rebarrelings? Could a gun smith detect that? Internet rumor?
Putting a bloop tube on my T3 might give me the feel of a longer barrel but it might be like having a penile extension... (guess I wont be buying a bloop tube now)
I am just looking to have a fun plinker that does shoot well. The only thing I dont like about buying surplus/used is its usually a crap shoot weather its a good one or a bad one. I am no expert when it comes to judging a surplus/used ffirearm. You dont know till you get to the range. My M91/30 barrel looked good but the bore turned out to be .315". When first shooting it, it patterned like a shotgun. After much work shims and finding a good load that will work with the oversize barrel it turned out to be a good shooter.
The only thing I read that worries me is I found some info that said some of the CG63 have been rebarreled several times and the stretching of the receiver has made them unsafe or prone to fail. Something about setting the barrel back each time it has a new barrel attached??? Not sure if what I read is correct. Is there a way to tell if the receiver has stretched and is going to fail from too many rebarrelings? Could a gun smith detect that? Internet rumor?
I have never heard of anything about the Mauser 96 or 98 actions stretching from a rebarrel. Only thing I heard about stretching of receivers was on the Enfields but even that might be a mouth/rumor (I only heard it once and didn't research it as I am not planning on owning any Enfields).
I wouldn't worry about that, especially so on the CG63 that were done at the GF factory or Norma. Simpsons Ltd has a good range of available CG63s to choose from. Look on their website and search for Swedish target to get a list.
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I don't think you'll find the same variance in a Swede as you sometimes find in a Mosin-Nagant. If you buy from a reputable dealer and you pick the right rifle, you should have a good shooter.
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That's where I got mine back in December. He's running low on them, though - you should have seen the inventory when I bought mine. They had so many with excellent bores, matching numbers and excellent bluing. The last time I looked, the number with excellent bores was pretty small.
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