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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
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Photo's in order at bottom of page....
NOTE: last three pictures at the following post



petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 04/21/2005 : 06:11:22 AM
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Hi Guys

I start a big post on Fakes & Frauds!

We are all collectors and buying good stuff is a problem on the todays market.

I`ll show the differences between the repro and the original sling. I`ll use a dead mint $400 German sling to make the diffences very clear! (btw not for sale)

I have to say first that that kind of german slings is very rare, most original sling are just dark brown!


I try to update ones in time, when I have some "need" information.

Start:


left you see an very good bla1944 postwar sling (sold as original on Ebay), the sling is possible postwar made by an county, it could be also reproduction! What I can say is that it`s postwar and the keeper or frosh come from Norway (1950-60).

German ww2 keepers does not have stitching above the leather, further you`ll find lines on each side from the leather-loop on the keeper.

The holes from the postwar slings are just to big, see both slings! only worned holes could be that big, those are just cut-off to big!

I see also that those stitches are not right..and so does that buckle not,but will keep that point aside!!

further..see photo`s *2, the slingloop is just home-made looking on the postwar sling. That should be very well made.(also on 44 slings)

I have many more points on this sling,,like the criss/cross pattern..and the structure of the leather..they put SAUER on it for sure..so you can make it old easy!


Those points were just the easy points, I think enough to judge yourself next time you want to pirchase a German sling.



**I`ll update time-to-time, you check it regulair when you want to learn something!**


best regards Tommy









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Edited by - s42 on 06/29/2005 8:16:21 PM

petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 04/21/2005 : 06:20:54 AM
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This is just the normal collor (after using) from German slings! The sling I compaired with the postwar made sling is very rare anyway,,will post photo`s on marking styles soon!




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petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 04/21/2005 : 06:41:45 AM
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Some attetion about the keeper or Frosh (in German)

You`ll see 4 genuine German WW2 keepers!

The 2 below (one with brass stud) are early war (or before), those could have "brass" and "iron" studs, further more..you can also see that they are some bigger, wider leather on the top en well treated. Further I can say is that eary keepers have often a crisscross pattern also in the keeper.

I beleve they made a crisscross pattern in only the slingloop on the keeper on later made slings. (often hard to see) (check the photo`s from my 1st photo on the post)

Early slings are often well marked with a hammered stamp. Like the WaA 655 in both early keepers.

Those 2 keepers above are from 1943 and 1944 (Dvr 43 and Dkk44), those are much quicker and less carefuller made and also are the markings. Those are often ink-stamps, allthrough I see sometimes hammer-hitted stamps. But not often, anyway..I see 43/44 sling very rarely. Some slings are just marked with a digit and a "4" I beleve that is 1944, Ones I sold a 1944 rifle with "4" on the reciever.

further I looked to the slings style,,,the condition matched the year.





I`ll tell more info later about buckles and other syles!

best regards Tom
us1945





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Edited by - petersmoke on 04/26/2005 09:35:03 AM


mowzerluvr
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



1612 Posts
Posted - 04/21/2005 : 8:50:27 PM
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Tom, very nice pictures. This is the type information we all need. From someone who has physically handled the many types and variants of slings. Not many people have had access to so many original slings and this information is well accepted. I would also suggest you write a small book on the subject. K98's and their accesories are coming more into view as the months roll on and the need for good, factual information is key. With the photos and information you could provide. You would be able to write a book on original wartime slings. You may not get rich but you and the collectors could benefit well from it. This is only a suggestion. Keep up the good work. And thank you for your efforts.
mow.

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Talk is cheap, because supply almost always exceeds demand.


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 04/26/2005 : 09:31:57 AM
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Hi Collector friends, I just sorted 100 German slings out again..I found some slings who will need some attention!!!


See some normal slings! Btw I allways feel like a little kid who is open his presents on Xmass day when I sort out slings..allways those markings..some are really stunning!!! Please enjoy my rare finds. see photo of some slings:




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I found 2 German WW2 slings with a different buckle, and they have many holes back in the sling. I just know for sure that it is WW2 German..and not rebuilt later or so. The sling-king askes for help on those 2. Seems rare to me..ANYBODY MORE INFO???? see photo`s:




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I also found 2 MP38 u 40 slings, both are marked on the buckle, Very nice supprice they were also between the 98k slings :) see photo`s:



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THIS IS ALSO VERY RARE!!!--->> We know the buckle makers: D&C /L&F / S tree C / etc, This sling hase a worned off buckleleather...and there is a dated marking on the back! Haven`t seen this before in 800 slings...I had also many without the leather.

see photo:



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I also found a OTTO KOBERSTEIN LANDSBERG a.W. sling, that`s the maker of one of the nicest original German WW2 G43 pouch! I have one in my collection! see photo! Just a nice find! (to show it near the pouch) see photo`s:



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I HOPE YOU ENJOYED MY TODAYS FINDS, I GLADLY HEAR IT WHEN ANYBODY COULD GIVE ME MORE INFO ABOUT THE 2 GERMAN SLINGS WITH OTHER BUCKLE`S AND MANY HOLES AT THE END OF THE SLING. (MAYBE TRAINER .22)(FG42?) (LATE EXPERIMENTAL?)

WILL GO DEEPER ON MAKERS AND SLING-STYLES SOON!! KEEP CHECKING THIS POST IF YOU WANT TO LEARN SOMETHING.

BEST REGARDS TOMMY

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Edited by - petersmoke on 04/26/2005 09:36:53 AM


mowzerluvr
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



1612 Posts
Posted - 04/26/2005 : 6:11:20 PM
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Tom,

I was at a large gun auction here in New Hampshire, USA last year and there was an original, last ditch Volksstrum Gewehr that sold for over $17,000. USD that had a sling like that on it. Was it original to the weapon??? No clue, but it had one. Could well be a very rare item indeed.
mow.


feldmutze
Gunboards Premium Member



USA
188 Posts
Posted - 04/26/2005 : 6:42:20 PM
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Petersmoke,
If those two odd slings have nine keeper holes, they appear to be K98a/K98az slings. The keeper should be similar to the K98k, but slightly longer. Earlier slings will have a brass keeper button (some unit marked), late slings will have a steel button.


mrfarb
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



1388 Posts
Posted - 04/26/2005 : 7:13:09 PM
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Tom,

I take exception to the thought that no WW2 keepers have the stiching on the end. I am attaching a photo of my vet bring back bcd4 made by Mauser at the end of the war, near Dec.1944 best we can tell. The sling has never been off of the rifle, because I am afraid I will break the keeper. It is very brittle leather, as it was made with some cheap, thin leather. Notice it is sewn on the edge. I do believe that the one you mentioned is post war, but the one on this rifle certainly is not. Also, notice the sling only has 2 stich lines instead of 3-- I notice some in your batch are similar-- perhaps later war economy measure?

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Check out my website- www.latewar.com


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 04/27/2005 : 03:45:53 AM
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Thanks for all the info..!!!


btw mfarb.. I still had to revice this. Your slings is an excepton..just made in WW2 by the Germans.

The stitching above the keeper is very rare seen,..and took me about 1000 slings to find one...wich whas also early marked.

anyway sorry for saying that it whas postwar. To many postwar slings showed up with the stitch above..I just don`t had the possibility open that the Germans also did...in a very little number.

best regards Tommy

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Edited by - petersmoke on 10/12/2005 05:07:45 AM


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 04/27/2005 : 03:47:22 AM
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BTW

found brass stutted keepers with the slings..

one had a number on the brass stud


best regards Tom


mrfarb
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



1388 Posts
Posted - 04/27/2005 : 07:42:15 AM
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Tom,

I must disagree- this keeper is the original one, brought back from the war by a US Vet, and has never been apart. The construction is similar to what you say, but the materials are not! The condition is similar to both, but the leather is very thin on the keeper- both are dry but still supple, and no aging has been done to either.

If this rifle were some put together, I could see it- but I still believe there are other styles of keepers that you have not seen in your 2000 sling collection. How many years did hard core collectors doubt the existence of the swjXE 98k?

I just say keep an open mind, as over 15 million slings were probably produced, and there is no way you have seen everything-- if you close your book now, you quit learning. If you choose to believe my keeper is post war, that is your opinion- other than that, take it for what it is worth.

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Check out my website- www.latewar.com

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Edited by - mrfarb on 04/27/2005 07:43:53 AM


Gewehr455
Gunboards Super Premium Member



450 Posts
Posted - 04/27/2005 : 1:24:58 PM
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I have seen many and own a few keepers from the later war period that posses this extra bit of stitching. A quick look thru about 40 or so keepers that I have stored together revealed six with this extra stitching. None of these are post war, and I have been at the game long enough to know the difference. It's not uncommon to find the leather around the sling slot on the keeper distorted, or in some cases missing all together from contact and adjustment with the sling. It's obvious why the Germans added this stitching.

Tom, how many slings and keeper have you found from the 44-45 time period? I have seen some other variations to the 98k sling and keeper from this period that strangely are not mentioned on your for sale page/website. With the numerous variations in construction, material, and stitching that can be found on most late war German leather, I think it's a bit rash to discount what you haven't seen as post war, don't you?

Here is a close to new condition cgu 4 marked sling and keeper with the extra stitching on the keepers sling slot. The sling has spent the last 60 years mated to a close to new condition byf 44 in the L block. I know the rifles history and it came home with this sling and keeper.

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petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 05:33:31 AM
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Hi

regarding your keeper..It`s just what I think..but why should they make a expensive sling in 44/45..when they made it without stitch from 1934-45. The keeper is also cleaned that`s why it like that..and not nice like your sling...keepers stay always very nice...even nicer than the sling.

Those are just postwar,..I see them on my fairs enough,,without marks...cost $10...hit a "CLG 4 "in it and it will bring $25...that`s the todays market.



regarding the photo`s: that`s a nice sling,..looks also very good..still I think that it could be postwar marked..anyway very old...otherwise,,,the 3 holes are to new,,,and to big..the stud from the keeper is also to big..

I highly presume it`s Norwayian 1955.

it will help when you forward some close up photo`s from the buckle..leather on it..and stitching etc.


And remember neary every sling wich we doubt about hase a stitching above the keeper..

I like your slings,.they look good anyway!

best regards Tom


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Edited by - petersmoke on 04/28/2005 05:41:32 AM


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 05:39:38 AM
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I beleve this is from the same faker:

it had also an eagle like chicken in the sling :)

It`s just not ww2...probably a few years later for a subcontracted mauser or so..

The keeper style is just the same...so does the mark style...

BTW one other note,..those deep markt are only seen on very eary 1939-1940 slings..later slings have a very thin stamped mark..or even with only a ink stamp. Those weared off fast,,that`s why we don`t see those regualair,,,same story with the thin 44 marks.

I will show a 44 sling soon..100% genuine.


I do not want to burn you down with your slings...I can imagine that think it`s real...I just give my 2 cents.


best regards Tom





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Edited by - petersmoke on 04/28/2005 05:45:58 AM


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 05/07/2005 : 5:35:57 PM
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a new fake 1944 showed up again..so will reply so the people get there attention. Will ad more info on other slings etc later,,

Have been busy last weeks.


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 05/31/2005 : 05:22:36 AM
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hello friends,


just want to warn you all!

Those are high class reproduction!

link:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=36049&item=6536126973&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW

further also repro:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=4078&item=6535862938&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW

and


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=4078&item=6535863489&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW



I were a milionar when I also stamped and reproduced! I just observe the repro`s and always keep on the straight way..feels better I guess.

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Edited by - petersmoke on 05/31/2005 09:54:05 AM


milspec1
Gunboards.Com Silver Star Member



USA
841 Posts
Posted - 05/31/2005 : 07:30:20 AM
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Could not get the links to ebay to work


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 05/31/2005 : 09:49:12 AM
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try on http://www.ebay.com

itemnr 6536126973

(copy it in the searchoption right above)

or try this link:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=36049&item=6536126973&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW





Will explain some! Not all because I don`t like to give fakers all the info they need!

At first I must say..that sling style looks late 1944/45 period: note the 2 stitchings at the buckle-side..and the stitched over the edge..now that is typical very late! (note that early slings have 3 stitchings most of the time)

But those slings are just reproduction!

*You always have to check the keeper, German WW2 keepers does not have stitchings on the top! Never! And even 1944 slings have a very thin line aside the loop on the keeper. And most of the time also crosshatch pattern...but that is often hard to see on used slings.

*further the collor of the sling it self is wrong, and they did not correct stamp the crosshatch pattern. I even think they did not made that! Very expensive to reproduce that for a littyle number of slings.

*the 3 holes are in size the same as on original German slings (not like those wrong to big holes they made on the reproduction "bla1944 and variants" slings. But those holes are hit from the inside of the sling..not with a machine..German holes are just smooth holes.

*Further I see only on the back that it isn`t a German WW2 sling..German slings have lines in the lenght. But that is a difficult point for a lot of people!

Further I would say stitching on the slingloop are too new..and so is the sling!


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Edited by - petersmoke on 05/31/2005 09:56:23 AM


bdgfate
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



1636 Posts
Posted - 06/01/2005 : 1:00:30 PM
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I have a L&F stamped sling off of a vet bring back CE44 that supports mrfarb and Gewehr455's positions. It seems to have a keeper with some stitching as well.

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petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 06/02/2005 : 04:39:56 AM
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Hey,

I know the type,,,have also one..but with normal un-stitched keeper!

I don`t know why yours have a stitched keeper,,strange! Maybe replaced in the years. Because the keeper is Norway `50 or so,,have seen many of them (like 1000p)

best regards Tom


Sarge
Gunboards.Com Silver Star Member



USA
751 Posts
Posted - 06/05/2005 : 03:14:46 AM
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I'll throw an odd ball sling item at you. I recently was going thru a box of leather items that I haven't been in for close to 20 years. Had to repack it so I could put some more stuff in that I'd been piling up for a long time.
I found 3 leather buckles, 1 marked and the other 2 unmarked. These are not made for the metal insert, just a piece of leather. Have you ever run across this item?
Sarge

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petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 06/05/2005 : 04:15:42 AM
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Hi Dave

you make me curious!! please post some photo`s of them..

best regards Tom


solman
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



USA
1615 Posts
Posted - 06/11/2005 : 02:12:32 AM
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Tom,I have a sling marked 'jme' i cant seem to get my photos to post.
the sling is been used to hunt and the leather is gone off the keeper? part. is this a kreigs marine sling? jme=armeemarinehuas Berlin,Berlin-Charlottenburg,Germany. e-mail me and ill send photos
solman

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Trompe la mort


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 06/14/2005 : 12:01:58 PM
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Hey Solman

drop those photo`s


BTW leather on the buckle worned off a lot..I find about 30 on 100 slings. People don`t get those because I sell those always in bulks to a k98 collector.


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 06/17/2005 : 12:07:20 PM
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Hello Friends

I just found an extremely rare German sling.. Note that it is not for sale..!! (I know how those things go..tomorow 150 e-mails in my mail box :) )

Anyway...this wil make it tougher for a lot people because..those slings look like the postwar-Austrian slings...with that bumb on the buckle side. (normal machined away on earyer slings)

So could be faked very easy!!

I have my sling from a WA-stock..so it`s preserved in a wooden box for over 55 years..it`s just like it`s made yesterday! I`m very pleased with this one..will show it near my original K-G43 pouches.


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Details:

It hase a very rough buckle-pin, and the pin on the begin of the buckle is just welder (see the bump),,,earlyer slings are always very good machines..they made it flat! So you nearly could not see that there is a pin in the buckle.



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Further..3 stitchings in the leather just in front of the buckle..very ugly sewed. Anyway..I see often 44 slings from other makers who stitched only with 2 lines.

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Note that some makers only marked there slings with a code and a single "4" with means 1944.


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AGAIN..watch out with slings who look amost the same..a Austrin sling cost $20 and a ink stamp is easy to make! You are warned..

I hope you enjoyed this one!






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Edited by - petersmoke on 06/17/2005 12:13:34 PM


xk319
Gunboards Super Premium Member



359 Posts
Posted - 06/30/2005 : 05:40:14 AM
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Regarding stitching on the keeper. I've read a few posts now of collectors saying they've received rifles directly from the veteran himself who took the rifle during the war with slings having certain characteristics that "experts" say never existed..... I just can't bring myself to not believe those collectors and believe the "experts", especially the ones who say never. You know the saying. I recall something a very high end collector said to my brother and I once, an old fellow I won't mention in name. In regards to things that people don't believe, or say NEVER could have happened with k98's. He said .... "I can't say it's 100% not correct, I wasn't there....were YOU there?". Ahahaha, I always crack up at that old wisdom. You can be very certain, but man, don't ever say something never happened.....

p.s. I'm surprised at your questioning of qualitybc's eBay items. I've never bought from him, but he has a flawless reputation among high end collectors. I know he defended himself against you over at glock and load forums. I guess he doesn't know about this thread here.

hmmm, wrote more than I intended.

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Edited by - xk319 on 06/30/2005 05:49:28 AM


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 07/05/2005 : 05:10:03 AM
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Hello friends

Sorry for the late reply..I just moved and haven`t got internet yet..so I`m still not settled. So have to i-net at others peoples PC.

Anyway..regarding the stitching on the keepers..Some seems to be German WW2. But still want to warn for postwar examples..who are also seen a lot these days.

best regards Tommy

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Edited by - petersmoke on 10/12/2005 05:10:17 AM


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 07/05/2005 : 05:12:34 AM
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BTW

I found a nice marked keeper yesterday...

really one of a kind!!


Weimar WaA 204 marked on the outside of the keeper..note also the rough eary pin.

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Bill In Indiana
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



1661 Posts
Posted - 07/23/2005 : 8:42:49 PM
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Thought I would jump in on the stiched or not stiched keeper debate.

I have two 98k's with original slings that I personally know the entire history of, from the day they came home, to the day I purchased them. One, a byf 41 that came back from Africa and is Luftwaffe marked has an unmarked, unstitched keeper. Only visible sling mark is an L&F buckle.

The second is a byf 44 with the keeper below....STITCHED! While I love the picks of the slings, I can't agree that stitched keepers are post war or fakes. Picture below for proof (dkk 44 marked)

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petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 07/26/2005 : 4:12:23 PM
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Hey Bill

Yes I know these..I say that those are postwar (+- 1950)

It`s possible that a keeper broke off the k98k 30 years ago..and they just replaced it with a good looking keeper..then you bought it after 30 year from old people,,well that`s a long time for a human mind.

They started stamping a long time ago..

50% of the original ww2 items on ebay are just not ww2 made,.,it`s just that items are excepted as original.

I see also that the stitching isn`t German ww2..in my beleving..and I see really many slings every day :)






Blue Division
Gunboards Member



71 Posts
Posted - 07/26/2005 : 9:08:01 PM
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Tommy,

You got mail...See if you can help me out.

Thank you
Blue


Bill In Indiana
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



1661 Posts
Posted - 07/26/2005 : 11:12:53 PM
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Petersmoke...I mentioned that I knew the history on this sling for one reason. I Know the sling and keeper pictured came home with the rifle. It was a family friend who took it home with him in 1946, and it has never been changed, modified or otherwise messed with. I know 100% that this sling keeper is correct. I understand you have seen many many slings, but I also understand it is not possible for you to have seen EVERY variant of sling.


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 07/27/2005 : 03:46:40 AM
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Hey Bill

It`s also true that I don`t know everything,,since I whas born to late :-( to join the party

Anyway..your keeper looks nice..so I trust your story and will give my doubs a change.

Will collect more info about those soon..I also found some..but expectet to be postwar because we don`t have seen them till on 1944 slings, and the latest postwar "so called: German slings" with bla1944 who came from Austria 1950 were also installed with the same keeper. But will dig further..I might have a final conclusion after that!

best regards Tom


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 07/27/2005 : 03:51:21 AM
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BTW Bill

about the stud; what collor does it have? or what vernis do you see? little bit black?? (seems to be on the photo)

best regards Tom


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 08/11/2005 : 09:12:38 AM
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Hello fellows,

I`m just back from the Costa Brava in Spain were I joined some holliday..so have fresh air in my brains again...:)

I also did a shocking discovery..I investicated the keepers with stitchings on the top. As we know many postwar keepers are made like this...BUT I also discovered that a veryyy little number German ww2 keepers is made like this. I nearly could not beleve this,,but found a sling within my un-messed slings with a proof. (felt pritty stupid at the moment..) But have to revice what I said earlyer!!

So keepers with stitchings above excist who are made in WW2. But still watch out with them because an stamp in easy made on a postwar example. I think that my recovery will make it only more difficult to judge a sling. Anyway..I`m a straight shooter...so Like to admit my fault to change history. Will enclose a photo!!

Anyway..I know the excistence from more rounded keepers who are postwar..further..I would not gamble on a dead mint example..as we have seen on ebay. Mostly unmarked..because a fake stamp is easy to detect on a smooth keeper. They fake better on the back of a sling. I hate people who do that..because I have sometimes a pain in the ass getting rid of my slings..and those fakers just hit a big bird in it..together with a fake RBNR,,with 1944...and they get a top price.



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I have one more shocking discovery next time...I just could not beleve my eyes when I found it! One of a kind! A ros1944 sling..stamped at the end..Just like the repro`s we seen a lot from Germany. Those repro`s are a hard case,,I know who transformed them..But still nice that the sort excist. More photo`s and info when I have some time.

best regards Tom

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Edited by - petersmoke on 08/11/2005 09:16:22 AM


Bob in OHIO
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



1119 Posts
Posted - 08/11/2005 : 09:49:45 AM
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Indeed. There is more to be learned. I too picked up a late rifle that had a late sling. It had a stitched keeper and I knew it was a period piece. The keeper is unmarked and the strap is maker marked.





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My CD full of K98 pics... http://bobinohio.com/

[email protected]


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 08/11/2005 : 1:01:54 PM
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Hi,

Yes It`s maybe good to discuss about items..and it migh be good to makes faults..so the truth could be recovered at the time (you you go deeper and deeper) It`s just a exciting hobby,

and we learn more every single day..from something wich hase still many secrets because our fans just burned nearly all info at the end of the second world war.

I don`t feel like a expert I gues I`m nothing more than a "so called expers", because people who were there in WW2 are even not expers...and those who knew are dead..they did there selves or Neurenberg. I hope I just can help to help finish the bookpart; German slings.

Interesting..so keep on discussing!!!


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 08/14/2005 : 11:25:01 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here ya go!



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Download Attachment:
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And..Don`t mix this up with the new-repro`s from Germany,,as I explained earlyer!


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 08/16/2005 : 05:14:58 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

BTW Let me know when you have a German WW2 G-K43 pouch for sale!!

I collect only pouches who were made in WW2, I don`t collect the good todays "look-a-likes"..

So need the blue ones from Otto (see photo`s back), a yellow one from the same material.


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 10/12/2005 : 04:41:14 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi Fellows

Soon more info to come..will start with my last 100 slings or so..

So we will see what shows up..wich I could show to ya!

Best regards Tommy

BTW will show what I like to collect. I beleve both are made in WW2. Not only because they look real...I also look to German measurements and other point from the pouch. Just let me know when you like to sell a simulair to mine..or a yellow example from so called rubber. (but I think not many people have one I need)


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Edited by - petersmoke on 10/12/2005 3:11:17 PM


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 10/26/2005 : 08:24:17 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Not many news fellows.. but that`s also because I don`t have many anymore...

But still found someting.


Some of you were conserned about a German mark on some early slings..it says "1851 OK"

so some tought that the sling whas made in 1851..But it had to be an early WW2 sling..so I just made clear it whas a factory name or so. Anyway.,,my point is that I just found such example with early Weimar eagle on the front. Haven`t seen this before.

check it out.




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best regards Tommy


Maybe later more to come..I hope so.

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Edited by - petersmoke on 10/26/2005 08:28:57 AM


EricOKC
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



USA
2314 Posts
Posted - 10/26/2005 : 6:54:22 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Tommy,
When you sent the five slings to me, three of them had that mark, and were stuffed in a genuine G43 puch.
Did you mean to send those to me?

Just kidding.

Eric


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 10/27/2005 : 06:26:05 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hey Guys...

It`s seems to be jackpot today...found one again!!

Really strange..found maybe 20 slings with that mark..and non of them were marked also with eagle on the front,,,now I find 2 within 2 days who have an eagle..nice



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BTW Eric..I feel sorry that I don`t found those earlyer..:) Otherwise you would have owned those..!! (note that both slings are allready gone..)


Later

Tommy

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Edited by - petersmoke on 10/27/2005 06:28:06 AM


Franchi
Gunboards Super Premium Member



USA
368 Posts
Posted - 10/30/2005 : 7:03:44 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Bob In OHIO, your sling is code marked oub. not qno, notice the period after the "b", this is so the code wouldn't be read upside down. "oub" is also seen on Czech. Cz 27 style holsters without a date or "WaA" acceptance. The code "oub." is a factory in Czechoslovakia.

petersmoke, there are German FN 1922 "dropping" holsters which are marked "BA 1815" inside an octagon, this is a Luftwaffe marking.
Your "1815 OK" marking might have Luftwaffe ties.

David Franchi


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 11/03/2005 : 06:23:50 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hey David

Well that`s good possible...because we found also 100 k98k`s...and several were marked with a "l" on the stock-side

Thanks

Best regards Tommy


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 12/10/2005 : 1:38:05 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I made some progress regarding the sling-keepers with the mark;


1851 OK


That`s also; Otto Koberstein , he seems to made Horse seats before the war,,,and during.

I found the number "1851" with his name,,,don`t know what it is...Maybe somebody who understands this "gegr.1851" ??????

Could it mean; gegrünt.....so they factory excist since the year 1851??

Full text; Landsberg an der Warthe Otto Koberstein, Sattlerwarenfabrik, gegr. 1851, Landsberg (Warthe).
1936.





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Edited by - petersmoke on 12/10/2005 1:41:48 PM


mowzerluvr
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



1612 Posts
Posted - 12/10/2005 : 2:08:48 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Tommy, have you ever seen another like this one. Is this post war or a genuine late war german?

mow.

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Talk is cheap, because supply almost always exceeds demand.


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 12/12/2005 : 06:07:47 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi,

Well I don`t know the exact mark...but it looks familiar. Does it have also a 1943..mark??

Have seen many German slings with "Prag" or "X prag" and or with 1943 mark.

So I think it`s German...or anybody does have more info about Czech postwar rifle sling makers.

Best regards Tommy




mowzerluvr
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



1612 Posts
Posted - 12/12/2005 : 9:21:33 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Tommy. No, it has a 1945 date below it just below Prag. Along the top edge of the stiching.

mow.

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Talk is cheap, because supply almost always exceeds demand.


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 12/13/2005 : 03:49:54 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi,

Well looks good in my eyes...never had a 45 sling before...but it looks good anyway. I don`t think fakers would make a Prag 1945 stamp....they kick more on codes like; Fuq 1944...and ros.

I would hold it!! Were did you found it? I might like to check the sling too...

Best regards Tommy


mowzerluvr
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



1612 Posts
Posted - 12/13/2005 : 5:12:31 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Tom. I dont have a sling with it. It came with a bunch of K98 parts I got. Dont remember where off hand. I have the sling loop as well. If I remember where I got it I will surely contact the guy and see where the sling ended up. Thank you for your examination.

mow

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Talk is cheap, because supply almost always exceeds demand.

END OF PAGE 1...................................................................................................................


Folks this is a VERY long posting with a lot of pictures---I will reply to topic with the following pages--then add the phots in order they where posted
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,622 Posts
Discussion Starter #2
first 3 photo's are a extension to the above posting for page 1..........
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,622 Posts
Discussion Starter #3 (Edited)
BEGINNING of page 2................



petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 12/24/2005 : 08:59:09 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Some very early slings keepers have a number on the brass stud. Like the one one the photo!

I don`t have any info what that means...maybe somebody any idea??

My quess is the last 2 digits from the rifles serial number!! Ones I saw a early sling with a complete 4 number serial in the back of the leather.

I`ll have my 100 last slings soon....I`m very happy...because I were allready outsold for a while...will try to give as much as possible information...because it will be really over after those.

It`s fun to have 100 slings..again...because I see new things every time...!! I just feel like a little kid on Christmas eve..when I check the slings...the first time....can`t descible that feeling...when you find a cool mark. Will miss that.

It`s really like hunting for gold...;-)




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Spitzenmeister
Gunboards.Com Silver Star Member



USA
572 Posts
Posted - 12/24/2005 : 10:44:29 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Peter, can you help me ID this sling please? Had it for years, I did a search, and the only reference was for a Chinese made sling for their K copy. It is marked 2804-02524 with either an Y or a sideways LG after that. The metal has a oriental looking mark in a circle (Japanese maru?) that resembles a 4.


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"Nations do not mistrust each other because they are armed, they are armed because they mistrust each other." - Ronald Reagan


drfting1
Gunboards Member



17 Posts
Posted - 12/24/2005 : 10:56:45 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

lljljkl


Sarge
Gunboards.Com Silver Star Member



USA
751 Posts
Posted - 12/25/2005 : 01:12:34 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

It'sd Isreali.
Sarge

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graf
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



USA
1294 Posts
Posted - 12/25/2005 : 1:56:44 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Yes, very early- pre-war Imperial... this imo is a Kar98a sling keeper.


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by petersmoke

Some very early slings keepers have a number on the brass stud. Like the one one the photo!

I don`t have any info what that means...maybe somebody any idea??

My quess is the last 2 digits from the rifles serial number!! Ones I saw a early sling with a complete 4 number serial in the back of the leather.

I`ll have my 100 last slings soon....I`m very happy...because I were allready outsold for a while...will try to give as much as possible information...because it will be really over after those.

It`s fun to have 100 slings..again...because I see new things every time...!! I just feel like a little kid on Christmas eve..when I check the slings...the first time....can`t descible that feeling...when you find a cool mark. Will miss that.

It`s really like hunting for gold...;-)




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73.81 KB

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--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Editor Military Rifle Journal - Eventual website:
http://militaryriflejournal.com/

http://gewehr98.com/



petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 12/27/2005 : 10:01:49 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hello

Yes I have seen this kind of keeper on early A/AZ slings I found between the normal ones...but often also on early k98k slings..so it`s just used on both types anyway.

So I hing we know for sure it`s early..only now...what the meaning of the "58" is??


BTW that sling 2 replìes back had a keeper wich is simuliar as postwar Norwayian replacement keepers. I know some things from German stuff...could say nothing about other mauser slings.

Hope you had all a great Christmas??


best regards Tommy


tjg79
Gunboards Super Premium Member



USA
357 Posts
Posted - 12/27/2005 : 4:23:38 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hello Gentlemen,

Who knows the source of a good quality repro sling that looks and fits like an original? Thank you and best regards to all of you!


walther43
Gunboards Member



32 Posts
Posted - 12/30/2005 : 08:41:00 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Tom or "petersmoke"

You claim to be trying to stop the "fakers" out there selling fake slings as originals.
You probably don't remember me,but I bought a sling from you sevral years ago. You have a lot of nerve trying to discredit the "fake sellers" out there, Try cleaning up your door step first. The sling you sold me was nothing like you described. You described it as a "marked sling" it wasn't,you described it has a very nice sling, in good shape,it wasn't,(very wore out with a break almost all the way through the sling)
I still have the sling,I wouldn't try to sell it,(I would have to take a loss on the sling if I did)
I didn't rconize you because you used a differnt name on a differnt forum, but when someone put "Tom" on thier reply and I noticed you were located in the Nertherlands,a light clicked on.

So with that said, maybe the others on this forum will take a second look at what you place on this forum. And maybe you wil be more honest in your dealings and not take amyone else for thier hard earned money.





Hambone
I Have A Tina Tuner Style Haircut



2647 Posts
Posted - 12/30/2005 : 11:32:56 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Aren't you the same guy bragging about how you were able to fleece some deceased vet's widow out of the firearms and memorabilia her dead husband brought back? And now you are here whining about a sling you think you overpaid for? Amazing.


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by walther43

Tom or "petersmoke"

You claim to be trying to stop the "fakers" out there selling fake slings as originals.
You probably don't remember me,but I bought a sling from you sevral years ago. You have a lot of nerve trying to discredit the "fake sellers" out there, Try cleaning up your door step first. The sling you sold me was nothing like you described. You described it as a "marked sling" it wasn't,you described it has a very nice sling, in good shape,it wasn't,(very wore out with a break almost all the way through the sling)
I still have the sling,I wouldn't try to sell it,(I would have to take a loss on the sling if I did)
I didn't rconize you because you used a differnt name on a differnt forum, but when someone put "Tom" on thier reply and I noticed you were located in the Nertherlands,a light clicked on.

So with that said, maybe the others on this forum will take a second look at what you place on this forum. And maybe you wil be more honest in your dealings and not take amyone else for thier hard earned money.




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



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Edited by - Hambone on 12/30/2005 12:08:45 PM


walther43
Gunboards Member



32 Posts
Posted - 12/30/2005 : 7:49:14 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

listen you moron

No one fleeced anyone, and no one was bragging. If you read the thread concerning this you would see. (if you can)

And what the heck has that have to do with this crook anyway??


Spitzenmeister
Gunboards.Com Silver Star Member



USA
572 Posts
Posted - 12/30/2005 : 8:29:33 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by walther43

and no one was bragging. If you read the thread concerning this you would see.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ok, let's do that. Here are your own exact statements from that thread:

1.) I ended up buying a ALL MATCHED including original sling, BYF 43 K98K for under $150 !
2.) She then showed us a Walther PPK waffenampt with holster, I got it for under $150!
3.) I then purchased a Walther P-38 with holster and extra clip AC43 for $150!
4.) Then bought a WW1 iron cross with 1939 clasp, a few RAD meadlas and some HJ stuff for a $100!
5.) She also had some jap stuff a rifle, looked to be a 6.5 and a helmet and a sword! … I couldn't believe it, picked al this up for under $550!
6.) This time I guess i hit the jack pot.

Yeah, how could anyone possibly confuse that with bragging. Nice use of exclamation marks to point out the jackpot you scored there by the way bro!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Nations do not mistrust each other because they are armed, they are armed because they mistrust each other." - Ronald Reagan


walther43
Gunboards Member



32 Posts
Posted - 12/30/2005 : 8:33:41 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

lol, maybe a little


mowzerluvr
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



1612 Posts
Posted - 12/30/2005 : 9:47:38 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Speaking for myself. I have no problems with Tom, Petersmoke or whatever other name he wants to use. If you had a bad deal with him I hope it gets resolved. I think he is on the up and up. His prices are not cheap, but what he sells from what I see is original stuff. With all the repro stuff out there its nice to know where to find the good, original equipment. Is it worth a little more money for piece of mind? Why of course it is, that is why people buy insurance. To me, he is my K98 insurance policy. I would not think he would knowingly cheat you walther43, obviously you have no satisfaction on a deal you feel went bad. My only hope is you get good resolution for your transaction. Other than that, I feel Tom is a good source of not only parts, but markings and pure knowledge of the parts that have passed through his hands.

mow.

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Talk is cheap, because supply almost always exceeds demand.


Sarge
Gunboards.Com Silver Star Member



USA
751 Posts
Posted - 12/31/2005 : 03:28:08 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hambone u. Spitzenmeister: (are you the same guy?)
I would agree that Walther43 is crowing a bit about his good fortune in what he bought and the price he paid - BUT, I see nothing in what was just posted about his having fleeced a widow out of anything!!!
If I had just been able to buy any or all of that stuff for those prices I would definately be happy with myself - AND SO WOULD YOU!!! It makes NO difference whether she set the price, he offered that amount and she accepted or she ask a higher price and he was able to haggle with her and get it down to the listed prices!!!!!
Sarge

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Spitzenmeister
Gunboards.Com Silver Star Member



USA
572 Posts
Posted - 12/31/2005 : 05:22:40 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Sarge

Hambone u. Spitzenmeister: (are you the same guy?)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

No sir.

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"Nations do not mistrust each other because they are armed, they are armed because they mistrust each other." - Ronald Reagan


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 12/31/2005 : 05:45:50 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Walther tried to refund some money after he had the sling...I know those people...they try it at 10 deals...and it works on 1/10....that`s how they make money.

BTW his sling is marked...but he didn`t ripped off enough people to buy some glasses

I offered to sent the sling back...but he didn`t want that.


why would I sell a bad sling when It gives me only a pain in the ass afterwards...everybody is always very honest with there new sling...!!

BTW IM CHEAP...PEOPLE PAY ALSO $80 FOR A SLING WITHOUT LEATHER ON THE BUCKE FE ON EBAY. I ask $85 next year..and some will go to Africa...for clean water or so. $85 means..all good!! (my standard)

Moderators...could you please block Walther43,,and remove those crap he said...?? It`s just a guy with a too small



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Edited by - petersmoke on 12/31/2005 05:51:20 AM


l.d.bruce66
Gunboards Premium Member



USA
244 Posts
Posted - 12/31/2005 : 09:17:24 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Tom $85 for a sling is way to much to pay when you just got a all matching byf mauser with original sling for $150. And a PPK with holster and P38 for 300 for the both When you can get away with things like that why ever pay top dollar.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
L.D.Bruce spec4 8/8FA camp stanley/ Firebase 4P3 south Korea 87/88


David R
Gunboards Premium Member



188 Posts
Posted - 12/31/2005 : 10:25:07 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Tom
Just sorted the 20 slings I bought from you, nice pieces. I will get up with you after the first to get some more.
Thanks
David


Hambone
I Have A Tina Tuner Style Haircut



2647 Posts
Posted - 12/31/2005 : 12:45:02 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I think your first two posts to this forum ( 1) whining and calling someone a crook; 2) Bragging about fleecing an elderly widow) speak volumes. Your follow up posts referring to me as a "moron" and attacking the integrity of forum members are not that impressive either. You might want to dump your screen name and start over. This "moron" would humbly suggest that you ease into this very good forum and its resident population with a bit more tact and discretion.


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by walther43

listen you moron

No one fleeced anyone, and no one was bragging. If you read the thread concerning this you would see. (if you can)

And what the heck has that have to do with this crook anyway??

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------




graf
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



USA
1294 Posts
Posted - 12/31/2005 : 5:17:07 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Known Boner for awhile & he definitely isn't Spitzer (though Spitzer is getting pretty righteous in my book of late nailing dudes who rip Grandma & then brag about it! Pretty audacious imo)

Spitz, its hard to believe I beat you in all those arguments back then- your pretty sharp witted sometimes- must of been a bad week?



quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Sarge

Hambone u. Spitzenmeister: (are you the same guy?)
I would agree that Walther43 is crowing a bit about his good fortune in what he bought and the price he paid - BUT, I see nothing in what was just posted about his having fleeced a widow out of anything!!!
If I had just been able to buy any or all of that stuff for those prices I would definately be happy with myself - AND SO WOULD YOU!!! It makes NO difference whether she set the price, he offered that amount and she accepted or she ask a higher price and he was able to haggle with her and get it down to the listed prices!!!!!
Sarge

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Editor Military Rifle Journal - Eventual website:
http://militaryriflejournal.com/

http://gewehr98.com/



Spitzenmeister
Gunboards.Com Silver Star Member



USA
572 Posts
Posted - 12/31/2005 : 7:29:00 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by graf

Spitz, its hard to believe I beat you in all those arguments back then- your pretty sharp witted sometimes- must of been a bad week?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If I can't be a smart-ass at work, I might as well here. Besides, I wanted to post some pics of Bill's work.

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"Nations do not mistrust each other because they are armed, they are armed because they mistrust each other." - Ronald Reagan


graf
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



USA
1294 Posts
Posted - 12/31/2005 : 7:59:45 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I hear you there, awesome work as usual for Bill; as its you I hope he charged you double?

Just kidding but wouldn't it of been funny him using my action to fix your stock? I suppose he found it elsewhere but obviously Bill didn't know you pissed on my leg a few times when he asked if I could spare a 98k action to fix a duffle cut 98k!



quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Spitzenmeister


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by graf

Spitz, its hard to believe I beat you in all those arguments back then- your pretty sharp witted sometimes- must of been a bad week?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If I can't be a smart-ass at work, I might as well here. Besides, I wanted to post some pics of Bill's work.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Editor Military Rifle Journal - Eventual website:
http://militaryriflejournal.com/

http://gewehr98.com/



Hambone
I Have A Tina Tuner Style Haircut



2647 Posts
Posted - 01/01/2006 : 08:25:09 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I need to take a screen snapshot of you two agreeing . But then again, how could one disagree with Bill's work? I woke up this morning to let the dog out looking for an omen for the coming New Year and this is what I got. I reckon all will be good for 2006, and happy new year guys.

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AlamoCity
Gunboards.Com Silver Star Member



597 Posts
Posted - 01/03/2006 : 9:24:26 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Well, to chime in and speak on behalf of Tom's slings, I recently recieved an outstanding sling from him. He even went to the trouble to find one that is marked with a specific year!

He and I emailed back and forth several times before I bought the sling and he always exhibited honesty and integrity.

I'm not saying someone could have a bad experience with Tom, but from my own experience and what I've read from others, it would be the exception and not the rule.

T

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The only thing you should feel when shooting terrorists is recoil.

“Without God, there is no virtue, because there’s no prompting of the conscience. Without God, we’re mired in the material, that flat world that tells us only what the senses perceive. Without God, there is a coarsening of the society. And without God, democracy will not and cannot long endure. If we ever forget that we’re one nation under God, then we will be a nation gone under.”
– Ronaldus Magnus (Ronald Reagan)

Looking for PU scope numbered: b-25776


EricOKC
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



USA
2314 Posts
Posted - 01/04/2006 : 12:19:41 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

All,
Bought five slings from Tom to get air freight down, sold three on EBay, kept two, and all three buyers were also very happy with the slings.

Eric




Reichpapers
Gunboards Super Premium Member



USA
517 Posts
Posted - 01/04/2006 : 01:40:48 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Yeah the 2 slings I purchased from Tom were as advertised...he sent me pics beforehand...knew what I was getting and liked it.

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I have nothing, whether informative, witty, or entertaining to add to my signature…


Waltherguy
Gunboards Premium Member



USA
119 Posts
Posted - 01/04/2006 : 09:49:13 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Find this an interesting post. I know NOTHING about slings, but just to add to the fuel of the stiched keeper debate, do you think some of the keepers were re-enforced for certain divisions (i.e. friged cold on the Eastern Front etc?) Sounds like something the Germans would do to me, make one better sling, instead of 5 desposible ones. Just my input, thanks for all the great info.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"In a man to man fight the winner is the one who puts an extra round in his magazine"
-Field Marshal Erwin Rommel



petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 01/13/2006 : 2:27:44 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I sorted out my last 100 slings..and a big part appeers to be nicer...and nicer marked!!

Found a very nice early Reichsheer 1936 sling..wich I like to show!!

It`s a decent sling with a rough early style buckle-pin, the 3 holes have not the raindrop shape.. I`ve seen that more on early slings.

Anyway...it hase 3 different scratched,,,one on the outside and 2 on the inside. It say`s "A H"..that must be a name or so... I didn`t do it..And it whas stored since the war. I`m dead serious here..

Most likely Anton Heinrich....;-) Any input here???




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176.87 KB

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Edited by - petersmoke on 01/13/2006 2:29:34 PM


Sarge
Gunboards.Com Silver Star Member



USA
751 Posts
Posted - 01/14/2006 : 01:48:26 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Tom
I finally got around to photographing my wierd sling buckle - not made for a metal center - that I told you about last June.
Have you seen one like this?
Well it wouldn't load so I guess it is to big and I can't resize it.
I'll try sending it directly to you and maby you can post it.
Sarge

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Download Attachment:
8.11 KB


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 01/20/2006 : 05:10:09 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi Sarge

I can`t save the JPG...I do see it in the e-mail.


Maybe you can try to post it..just make it smaller in "paint" standard issue in your Windows. You have to look for an option like stretch and smaller or so.

Best regards Tommy


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 02/08/2006 : 2:24:48 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I were thinking...

I own a g43 magazine pouch from Otto Koberstein..wich is 100% German no doubts about that...and it hase a WaA14 mark...(see photos in this post)


Now I found a sling...also from Otto Koberstein..with a WaA94


So we`ve got 1 maker and 2 WaA`s...any idea`s???



I know Otto Kobersteind..and he seems to have a brother either in the war industy... I also know that Otto made horse seats since 1851...and that he made slings with Weimar eagles..so appeers to be early...see also 1938 slings from his...and he made g43/k43 pouches and other stuff since 1943 or 1944.


any help is appriated!!! Is it possible that they recieved an other WaA during the war?? Maybe somebody with WaA book?? Because I don`t get it.



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Pisgah
Gold Bullet Club



954 Posts
Posted - 02/08/2006 : 6:13:55 PM
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Waffenamt numbers and stamping kits were issued to an individual officer. When that officer was assigned to a factory, he in turn issued out the necessary punches/dies to the NCO's and civilians who did the actual inspecting and marking. When that officer was reassigned to another site he took his kit with him. I will give an example using Mauser Oberndorf. In 1934 and 1935 they had several different pre-Waffenamt inspection markings. In 1935 WaA 211 and WaA 63 inspection markings first appeared there. In 1935 WaA 211 was also found on Mauser Borsigwalde rifles. From 1936 until some time in 1939 WaA 63 was used on Mauser Oberndorf rifles. Some time in 1939 WaA 655 appeared at Mauser Oberndorf and continued until mid 1941 when it was replaced by WaA 135. WaA 63 reappeared on parts found on the Czech manufactured rifles (dou. and dot). It seems that the officer assigned WaA 211 received his initial experience/training at Oberndorf before being transferred to Borsigwalde when that facility opened up. I am sure that the same situation existed with the officer assigned the WaA 63 kit who had the responsibility for inspections at Oberndorf until mid 1939 at which time he was likely transferred to occupied Czechoslovakia for the takeover of weapons manufacturing at the Czech facilities. Some factories may have had more than one inspection team on site at one time and inspectors were occasionally transferred. So, different Waffenamts found on items from the same factory is not unusual. It likely signifys different dates of manufacture or that manufacturing at that facility may have been spread out and utilized more than one inspection team.

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http://www.trunkmonkeyad.com


SONICMASD
Gunboards Premium Member



USA
176 Posts
Posted - 02/10/2006 : 12:30:29 AM
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interesting stuff pisgah!

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www.marcofilms.com


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 02/10/2006 : 09:07:04 AM
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Hey Pisgah,

That`s a lot of good information you giving!!

Thanks you very much!!!

Best regards Tommy




petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 05/09/2006 : 11:08:02 AM
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Will get back to you all next week!!!




Best regards Tommy


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Edited by - petersmoke on 05/09/2006 3:31:17 PM


solman
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



USA
1615 Posts
Posted - 05/09/2006 : 12:57:58 PM
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any more stocks? ill email.

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Trompe la mort


5mei
Gunboards Member



19 Posts
Posted - 05/09/2006 : 2:43:48 PM
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Jup, he'll also have new stocks, don't you Tommy ;).


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 05/09/2006 : 3:19:53 PM
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Will get back to you all next week!!!


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Edited by - petersmoke on 05/09/2006 3:30:26 PM


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 05/18/2006 : 09:30:08 AM
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OK GUYS I`M COMPLETELY BACK AGAIN..AND SORTED OUT A PART OF THE SLINGS!!! (The 1st 100 are fun..after those a pain in the ass. BUT THIS WAS THE LAST TIME I SHOPPED FOR SLINGS.

THEY ARE GONE IN THE WAREHOUSE AND I HAVE THE LAST BUNCH...I HEARED THAT THE GERMANS DOES NOT MAKE THEM ANYMORE THESE DAYS

ANYWAY FOUND SOME NICE STUFF TO SHOW!!!


A pritty early sling with serial and "k" on the outside of the buckle. Does any body knows the meaning of that "k" (Kurz??) The sling seems to be early production to me.



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The other slings is very dangerous to show..because there are so many repro`s on the marked of those (I showed on p.1) that you easy can say not 1 is original. I found 2 originals in the stock: Bla1944 produced German sling.



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And yes it`s 100% German WW2. Other than those postwar transformed slings.

One more exceptional mark..an eagle marked at the outside of the end of the sling.



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I`ll sort out more slings later..and I think I`ll have more to show!!!


PEOPLE KEEP POSTING YOUR SLING IN QUESTION..WE WILL CHECK IF IT`S AUTHENTIC GERMAN WW2!!!!



petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 05/18/2006 : 09:40:50 AM
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2 MORE NICE SLINGS

AN EARLY SLING MARKED ON THE OUTSIDE WITH A BIG WEIMAR EAGLE AND A REICHHEER 1936 MARK AS WELL.



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A SLING WITH A RBNR ON THE KEEPER...PRITTY SCARCE!!



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BOTH SLINGS ARE GONE YET, I`LL GET BACK TO MY CUSTOMMERS BEFORE THEY ARE MAD..I GET SO MANY E-MAILS THAT I NEED TO GO TO MY E-MAIL-BOX AND RUN TO THE PO TO SPENT TOO MANY BUCKS.

I`ll sort out more slings later..and I think I`ll have more to show!!!


PEOPLE KEEP POSTING YOUR SLING IN QUESTION..WE WILL CHECK IF IT`S AUTHENTIC GERMAN WW2!!!!


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Edited by - petersmoke on 05/18/2006 09:42:11 AM


RayG_Wisconsin
Gunboards Super Premium Member



USA
495 Posts
Posted - 05/18/2006 : 12:03:42 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quote: "I know Otto Kobersteind..and he seems to have a brother either in the war industy... I also know that Otto made horse seats since 1851...and that he made slings with Weimar eagles..so appeers to be early...see also 1938 slings from his...and he made g43/k43 pouches and other stuff since 1943 or 1944."

As Petersmoke knows I also have a Otto Koberstein G43 pouch but in addition I have a early drop tail Lufwaffe buckle with the date of 1935 and "LBA" and the name "Otto Koberstein Landsberg aW" stamped on the leather tap. The buckle is stamped RS&S, (Richard SIEPER & Sohne ).
Also stmped on the leather tab is a drop tail eagle and swaski and the name Neubausen Aufkl Gr121 stamped inside a rectangle in one place (Reconnaisance Group 12 was based in Neuhausen) and Neubausen is stamped again on the tip of the leather. Just for info, that was a concentration/labor camp! It was also the VI rocket production facility after the Pedumunda works was bombed! The production end of it was all underground - a huge complex. The Russians closed the entrances (dynamited) at the end of the war. Just posted this to confirm that Otto was making military leather items in the 30's at least, Ray

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Ray G


madboy357
Gunboards.Com Silver Star Member



USA
889 Posts
Posted - 05/18/2006 : 2:21:09 PM
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More thinly veiled advertising by a non-sponsor.....


creepiE
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



USA
1768 Posts
Posted - 05/18/2006 : 4:47:58 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Gee...really...ya think??? LOL

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"Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not."
~Thomas Jefferson


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 05/20/2006 : 09:51:08 AM
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Thanks Ray, you have really a nice g43 pouch!! And yes Otto was bussy before the war..I`ve seen also slings with big Otto Koberstein 1938 marks. One time even a 1937 mark.

Btw Madboy, I don`t know why you post that negative opinion on my post..because I never had a problem with you!! Anyway maybe you missed it..but I made regulations with some of the gunboards moderators. And they had no problem with my post when I warn, educate and entertain other collectors.

BTW I sold 1 sling in 6 months trough the Gunboards here. That`s $15 profit..and not enough to make a post..and keep it updated.

When any more people have a problem with me..just e-mail me..and we talk about it. This is not right.







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Edited by - petersmoke on 05/20/2006 09:52:55 AM


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 06/26/2006 : 07:53:40 AM
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mowzerluvr

A while back you asked if the Von Waldow slings were genuine..I tought there were...

Anyway I was cleaning up and I discovered a small box with a simulair sling in it...that was a supprise!! I found it like 4 years ago in the warstock..so it`s German WW2 for sure. (but I think that we allready decided that..because your keepers looks good)

So this is your full proof.



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Best regards Tommy


EricOKC
Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



USA
2314 Posts
Posted - 06/26/2006 : 09:39:27 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

All,
Milsurp collecting, selling, and buying doesn't get much better than what Tommy does here.
He's taking an incredible amount of time to sort these, educate people, and sell these.
Imagine if someone with no to little interest had acquired the slings instead of him...they'd be scattered to the four winds, with valuable information forever lost.

I just wanted a decent sling for my RC K98, and wanted it to be authenic, and ordered up five for better pricing.
Tommy sent me five with a description of each, so I knew which two to keep, and which three to sell.
The buyers of my three were extremely happy with what they received and especially the price, since I was able to start the bidding at a lower price.

I'm not a sling collectoor by any means, but I have to appreciate what he's doing for the guys here who are.

Eric




petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 06/26/2006 : 09:58:29 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Thanks for your positive feedback Eric!! It`s apriciated!!


6 years ago I went to my friend house..and in his backgarden there was a open door..and I saw like 1500 strange straps...didn`t knew what they were..

Anyway,,,a year later I saw those again..and I asked my friend what they were..and he explained that there were genuine German WW2 slings.

Half a year later I got interest in the German semi-automatic G-k43..and notist that there was so little info about these slings..because so less people had an real German sling.

That was the time there was 1 sling each month on ebay. Most likely a postwar sling too.

So I decided to do someting.

Now 3/4 years later..I sold 2000 slings or so...they are really allmost sold out. That`s a pitty...but I still think I did the right thing for the people.


I`m sure many of the expers would have a repro sling on the rifle without my help..and owning it as a WW2 sling.

I`m sure everbody would have done the same in my shoes.. I feel lucky to got the change to do something for the marked. That`s something they can`t take off from me.


Best regards Tommy


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 09/17/2006 : 2:16:46 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi again,

I just recovered about 40 German WW2 slings..and there was some nice stuff within. (anyway it looks interesting..but need some help here)

Very early sling (fat buckle pin and paint on the buckle)

There is a strange mark on the keeper (keeper looks very early too)


IS THERE ANYBODY WHO CAN INDENTEFY THIS mark??? POSSIBLE 1933-1934 SLING??

(we also got the slings from special early rifles...like Reichspost and reichsbahn rifles)



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Spitzenmeister
Gunboards.Com Silver Star Member



USA
572 Posts
Posted - 09/17/2006 : 2:58:57 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by petersmoke

There is a strange mark on the keeper (keeper looks very early too)

IS THERE ANYBODY WHO CAN INDENTEFY THIS mark??? POSSIBLE 1933-1934 SLING?? ]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In your case, I'd say that's the rare and much sought after Der Hunderdollar Geldgierig Marke.

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"Nations do not mistrust each other because they are armed, they are armed because they mistrust each other." - Ronald Reagan


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 10/09/2006 : 07:02:20 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A good repro (ex-postwar) on ebay:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ORIGINAL-1944-G...goryZ135QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


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Discussion Starter #4
photo extension of page 2
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
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petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 10/11/2006 : 07:01:07 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I found a nice sling...must be one from those early rifles wich we parted out..those had also finger grooves.


see pics. 1935 Stuttgart. LMK when you collect this...I don`t..

Have also a Reichsheer sling..



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Any question about German slings..LMK..I would be happy to look if your sling is German WW2.

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Edited by - petersmoke on 10/11/2006 07:03:04 AM


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 12/18/2006 : 3:35:29 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

One fine 2 stitched late war (1944) made sling (44 on buckle)



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Most of the 2 stitched is not marked with "44"


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 12/19/2006 : 08:44:06 AM
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A lot of money for a postwar sling


http://cgi.ebay.com/Original-Sling-...ryZ36049QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 01/11/2007 : 3:08:16 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Make your slings question on this post... one threat with info will help everybody..and it will be better and better...people are asking the same questions about slings every month.

Best regards Tommy

sn1945
Gunboards Super Premium Member



317 Posts
Posted - 01/11/2007 : 4:33:54 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Pete do you have a website for slings you're selling? Please PM if you have one. Thanks!


award
Gunboards.Com Silver Star Member



USA
660 Posts
Posted - 01/11/2007 : 5:07:57 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I am just glad that I don't have to think about a sling and getting ripped.
I'll just use barnstring.

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Look, I'm a fair guy, but this heat is driving me crazy!

The difference between involvement and commitment is like an eggs-and-ham breakfast: the chicken was involved, the pig was committed."


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 01/12/2007 : 01:27:28 AM
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Yes look in my personal info. But website is not up-to-date..

Best regards Tommy


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 01/15/2007 : 12:22:03 PM
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Just checked out my slings-supply...have only 4 $125 slings left..man this is the end of a 1500p story. I started with $60 each 3 years ago...now people pay every week $175 + shipping each...for a incomplete sling,, (when I knew people would pay that 3 years ago...no just joking..I`m not that gay..I really enjoy this hobby)

I`m also happy I could help people out...I often only earned $10..sometimes $15 with a rare sling...some people hate me because they think I earned a lot of cash...well I paid my slings by 100..and price doubled after 700 or so.

Anyway.. Realice there was only a half broken incomplete sling on ebay ones in a while till 3 years ago..

I keep going advicing people about slings..so LMK on this post..and let`s keep this alive!!!

REMEMBER..STUPID QUESTIONS DOES NOT EXCIST...ONLY STUPID ANSWERS SO LET IT KNOW IF YOU ARE NOT SURE ABOUT A SLING OR MARK..OTHER PEOPLE WILL LEARN ALSO FROM IT


Maybe can change a moderator the title??? There should be something like: US1945`s big SLINGS post, German/postwar/repro questions.


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 02/09/2007 : 03:20:36 AM
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people...

I`m allmost through my last slings...happy to have only 7 left...because I also sell my personal slings.


I just found some very cool slings within my personal stuff. It`s 1936-early 1937 stuff in great condition. If somebody feels attracted to the slings,,,LMK..because I have still no rifles.. I`m not that expensive as my b-slings go on Ebay these days.

I wanted to keep them..for later in case I bought some early rifles...man I probably can keep everything Would be happy when those slings meet some nice early rifles.

Best regards Tommy


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Edited by - petersmoke on 02/09/2007 03:22:31 AM


jumo213
Gunboards Premium Member



Germany
212 Posts
Posted - 02/09/2007 : 07:50:26 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

What for a sling do I have? Thanks in advance.



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regards jumo213

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Besseres kann kein Volk vererben,
als der eigenen Väter Brauch.
Wenn des Volkes Bräuche sterben,
stirbt des Volkes Seele auch.


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 02/14/2007 : 09:49:24 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Thank you for posting your sling,,I don`t know what kind of sling this is..


Anybody an idea???






David R
Gunboards Premium Member



188 Posts
Posted - 02/14/2007 : 10:27:28 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi
The quick detach end looks like a Gew 88.
Thanks
David


feldmutze
Gunboards Premium Member



USA
188 Posts
Posted - 02/14/2007 : 11:14:34 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Jumo213, it's a Gewehr 98 sling.


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 04/07/2007 : 08:48:37 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

.


jumo213
Gunboards Premium Member



Germany
212 Posts
Posted - 04/08/2007 : 05:42:29 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

What about this one? No stamps.

Jumo213

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Besseres kann kein Volk vererben,
als der eigenen Väter Brauch.
Wenn des Volkes Bräuche sterben,
stirbt des Volkes Seele auch.


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 05/13/2007 : 11:47:20 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Jumo looks like an original German WW2 K98k sling with a MP38/40 stud. Your missing the loop and keeper...and the leather tab on the buckle.

Half the 98k sling didn`t have a buckle mark. Sometimes a mark on the back but those weared off a lot. Marks on the keepers are often better preserved.

Best regards Tommy

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Edited by - petersmoke on 05/13/2007 11:47:55 AM


petersmoke
Gunboards Premium Member



Netherlands
229 Posts
Posted - 05/13/2007 : 11:53:09 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

BTW guys...just found a small bunch with original K98k slings..all complete and with buckle leather (rare these days) So for people who read my post and can run.

Also I found 2 nice original mint Otto Koberstein keepers...I showed a few begin this post..see that left example on this photo..that one is marked on the front with OK1851 (they made horseseats since the year 1851, for people who forgot)

I never saw one like this before.

Best regards Tommy


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