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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have come across a BM that has the B.#### serial number on the side of the frame, as do the ones seen in pictures in other posts here, but this one has no British proof marks on the barrel or the frame (or anywhere for that matter).

I haven't been able to really get my hands on this pistol yet, so can't share any pictures, but I'm told the number on the barrel matches the rest of the pistol. What's most puzzling to me is that, while it looks like it has never been fired, and the bore is mirror bright (could almost be chromed), the lands and grooves in the bore are pretty faint. Does the B#### serial number always indicate British contract? Do all British contract BM's have the proof marks? What's up with the bore condition? As it's the first BM I've seen this close I have no comparables, so I'd appreciate input from the BM experts on this forum.

Thanks.
 

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The British Order BM"s carried the Bxxxx number on the right side of the frame, the lack of british proofs is due to the fact that after the war,when a batch of BM's were destined for the civilian market, they were stamped because that was necessary for its commercialization-After the British Army decided to sell its BM's a surplus to overseas markets those units left the UK without proofs,and tht is the case you are mentioning-About the deepness of the land and other characteristics of the barrel I cant say much, personally never paid attention to that detail,though I have a couple, one proofed and the other unproofed-I'm away from my guns until next week, I'll check this point then-Below pics of my BM's


 

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The British Order BM"s carried the Bxxxx number on the right side of the frame, the lack of british proofs is due to the fact that after the war,when a batch of BM's were destined for the civilian market, they were stamped because that was necessary for its commercialization-After the British Army decided to sell its BM's a surplus to overseas markets those units left the UK without proofs,and tht is the case you are mentioning-About the deepness of the land and other characteristics of the barrel I cant say much, personally never paid attention to that detail,though I have a couple, one proofed and the other unproofed-I'm away from my guns until next week, I'll check this point then-Below pics of my BM's
Raul, you must be on mobile.

So. If I understand correctly, the 4 digit serial number guns had the B added later in order to mark them as commercial batch and differentiate them from non-commercial batches. Right?
 

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All the pistols procured by the British had the Bxxxx number, this was an internal number ordered by them, besides each BM had the standard factory serial number that was correlative with the production .The markings I'm talking about are situated on the rear of the barrel on the upper part of the chamber that can be seen through the ejection port-I cant put a picture of the detail because I'm out of my home, those at hand were the ones I had in Photobucket-Wednesday I'll return to my home and I'll post the pic showing what I'm talking about-The stamp has a quantity expressed in TONS and another small stamp I cant remember
 

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All the pistols procured by the British had the Bxxxx number, this was an internal number ordered by them, besides each BM had the standard factory serial number that was correlative with the production .The markings I'm talking about are situated on the rear of the barrel on the upper part of the chamber that can be seen through the ejection port-I cant put a picture of the detail because I'm out of my home, those at hand were the ones I had in Photobucket-Wednesday I'll return to my home and I'll post the pic showing what I'm talking about-The stamp has a quantity expressed in TONS and another small stamp I cant remember
So then Range's pistol is from British Contract since it has B followed by 4 digit serial number?
 

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Could perfectly be, if it aint a fake, which I doubt, because to do so they would have had to obtain a BM with a serial number of that period(1941/42), which is not easy and the profit
after faking the item would have been minimal or nil-Lets wait for the pics Range will post, it would be interesting that he checks the serial number of the gun, situated at the heel on the backstrap of the gun, I dont remeber exactly the bracket inside which the british order fell, but I'll have it as son as I return home-
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
S/N on BM

This has all been very useful. Thanks.

I'll try to get in front of the gun again soon (and grab some photos), but I do recall the serial number at the bottom of the backstrap as being 16### (the remainder of the s/n escapes me.

Could perfectly be, if it aint a fake, which I doubt, because to do so they would have had to obtain a BM with a serial number of that period(1941/42), which is not easy and the profit
after faking the item would have been minimal or nil-Lets wait for the pics Range will post, it would be interesting that he checks the serial number of the gun, situated at the heel on the backstrap of the gun, I dont remeber exactly the bracket inside which the british order fell, but I'll have it as son as I return home-
 

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I'm back home, the BM's show:

B5853, serial #19368-On the barrel a stamp reading: 900'7 TONS, an illegible stamp and a stamp showing an IP but in horizontal position
B6473, serial # 20488 no stamps at all-
Below pics but not good, cant understand the macro of the camera and my son is on vacation, so I did the best I could-
Range, as you see your BM falls into the bracket of the period, its an original-
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Thanks Raul. You've cleared up a bunch of questions. I was confused by the lack of proof marks, but it appears that's not unique.

I don't own this BM (at least not yet), so can you give me a sense of what a British BM, without the proof marks, is worth? The only British ones I've seen online recently are listed for serious coin, well out of sync with Argentinian service models.

I'm back home, the BM's show:

B5853, serial #19368-On the barrel a stamp reading: 900'7 TONS, an illegible stamp and a stamp showing an IP but in horizontal position
B6473, serial # 20488 no stamps at all-
Below pics but not good, cant understand the macro of the camera and my son is on vacation, so I did the best I could-
Range, as you see your BM falls into the bracket of the period, its an original-
 

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Range, though I'm not in the US I can give you a ballpark number for the British Order BM, it should be around 1000 bucks, consider the rarity of the piece and that it , as you say, looks unfired_=Tell us when the purchase is done and post pics-bibi
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Thanks Raul. I will try to get pictures in the next couple of days.

Range, though I'm not in the US I can give you a ballpark number for the British Order BM, it should be around 1000 bucks, consider the rarity of the piece and that it , as you say, looks unfired_=Tell us when the purchase is done and post pics-bibi
 

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Found this, useful data about dates of production of BM's-
Serial Number Range / Date Range
1 - 12,000 / 1938 - 1942
12,000 - 23,000 / 1942 - 1944
23,000 - 108,000 / 1944 - 1953
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
At long last...

For a variety of reasons it is only recently I'm in a position to close the loop on this thread, and show some pictures of the British contract B-M I referenced when I started this thread oh so long ago.

At any rate, hope you don't mind, here are some photos. No British proof marks.



 

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As far as the lands and grooves on the BM are concerned, My own BM is from 1946 and is yes well worn. But is also very very accurate and yes has "faint "for lack of a better term lands and grooves. My theory is that the BM barrels were not cut that deeply to begin with (maybe they did not need to be). It may also be note worthy that mine is marked 11.25mm instead of 11.4mm, I have often wondered about that.
 

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Anomalous, there are two ways that the BM is officially called in Argentina .45 and 11.25mm, never 11.4mm, having said this,when you mention that your slide is marked 11.25mm I went to my gun room and in the three BM's I have they have .45 on the slide, I'm trying to remember if I ever saw one marked as yours, though I'm not an expert on BM's, but I cant recall that inscription, gonne search about this and post back
 
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