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On the old board, someone had started a survey to see how many of us were interested in newly manufactured 7.65 French Longue (for 1935A and S Semi-Autos). Where does that stand? Can this be revived? Unfortunately I can't remember who instigated the thread.
I, for one, am still interested.
 

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I, for one, am very interested. Was thinking about this just the other day, wondering how much pent up demand there might be and what a supply of proper ammo or brass would do to 1935A / 1935S prices.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Brass

Hi
The brass itself is available at Graf's and so are bullets. If loaded ammunition were available,
that would avoid having to get the proper dies, though I think any .32 die might work.
Perhaps the poster who made the offer will chime in on this new board. Several members had shown interest on the old board. The idea was to gather a sufficient quantity to warrant a new production.
 

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Il était moi

It was me. I've been too bu-lazy to sign up for the new board. I was a bit frustrated that my original thread got snuffed as I wanted the feedback for my request. I had to make it without any backup documentation. A business associate of mine is making the request so the answer may take awhile due to his schedule.

The Bertram brass currently sold is $1 each :-0

My backup plan is to have some 32 S&W Long casings turned down and shortened. I just picked up the initial test run of about 50 pieces. Now I've got to load them, but my RL stuff is all packed due to a move. This next step will take a couple of weeks or more, when I can make time.

If I can't convince a manufacturer to make factory loads, is anyone interested in modified S&W L brass?
 

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Discussion Starter #5
7,75 Mm Mas

Hi Coup par Coup:

Thanks for posting.

Beware, though; Buffalo Arms has brass (from .32SW long at .55 each) and loaded ammo for slightly above $ 1 each. So this may be price sensitive.
Best approach would be properly headstamped loaded ammo for under $1; while still steep, if the brass is reloadable it would be worthwhile (even it you can count on 10-15% of the ejected brass on being lost). Still I would be interested in that scenario.
 

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Converted once-fired's

Do you think anyone would be interested in coverted once-fired 32 S&W L's to load for the 7.65 L? Once-fired's cost is much less.
 

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Greetings,

I don't see why anyone would mind once fired 32 S&W Long rounds for conversion. I've made my 7.65 French Long using that case and I've reloaded in several times with no problem. Once fired shouldn't be an issue if the cost came down.
 

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If you are going to form your own I'd suggest you consider starting with S&B 32 S&W Long brass. The rims on the S&B's Longs I've used are basically identical to 32 Auto. I expect that S&B simply uses the tooling for 32 Auto when making their 32 Long ammo.
 

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Update

Still haven't got a definate answer regarding new 7.65L. I've started on my backup plan to modify .32 S&W L casings. More to come when I reach another milestone.
 

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7.65 MAS(7.65 French L)

I've been working on loads for the 7.65 MAS. Buffalo Arms has brass ($44 for 100) converted from .32 S&W Long, and I've used Sierra 85 grain jacketed round nose bullets. I have found a decent load with 3.5 grs Unique at about 1040 FPS. I have found that 3.6 and 3.7 grain charges work also, but when going past that to 3.8 grains I experianced pressure/velocity spikes.

This round was built around an 86 grain FMJ bullet and meant to have 1120 FPS velocity. This is much higher than a .32ACP and the two are not interchangeable.

I have used .32ACP reloading dies, but must use a special RCBS shell holder at about $20. RCBS does make special reloading dies for the 7.65 MAS, but they are over $175. The .32 ACP dies work, but they have to be carefully adjusted. I only size about .125 of the case mouth. I adjust the expanding die to just open the case mouth enough to start a bullet into the case. The seating die works well, but has to be adjusted higher than normally used in .32ACP.

The 77 grain bullets for the .32ACP are a little light for the 7.65 MAS. These should work, but I have not yet worked up a load for them. THis round is referred to as "whimpy". I find it pretty close to a .380ACP. No an elephant gun, but still decent.
 

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>I've been working on loads for the 7.65 MAS. Buffalo Arms has brass ($44 for 100) >converted from .32 S&W Long, and I've used Sierra 85 grain jacketed round nose bullets. I
>have found a decent load with 3.5 grs Unique at about 1040 FPS. I have found that 3.6 and
>3.7 grain charges work also, but when going past that to 3.8 grains I experianced >pressure/velocity spikes.

(Disclaimer: Your experience may vary depending on brass, bullet, seating depth, reloading technique, etc. used for your loads)

This was my experience as well. Two years ago, I tested using 7.62 Fr.L Bertram brass, Sierra 85 gr. jacket bullets and Unique powder with my test loads between 3.1 to 3.9 grains of Unique. I had positive results/ejection/accuracy using between 3.4 and 3.7 grains in both the 1935A and MAS 38. From my perspective, there is no need to go higher than 3.7 grains of Unique when using the 85 gr Sierra FMJ.

Type 96 LMG
 

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Think you are going to have to either convert .32 S&W Long brass or buy the Bertram brass. Nobody other than Bertram makes it, and other than the French Government, no one else ever has.

Too bad. These pistols (1935A and 1935S) are great shooters. Can't tell you how many times I've read that the 7.65 MAS is 'under-powered'. Bull cookies. Just about the same power level as the .380 ACP. Not exactly an elephant gun round, but hotter than the old .32 ACP (and much better than throwing rocks).

The 93 grain FMJ bullet available for the .30 Luger will work in this cartridge. Only problem is that I don't think velocity above 1020 FPS can be reached safely with the 93 grain FMJ. The best I've gotten my 86 grain Sierra RN to reach is 1050 or so before pressure signs develope. I use Unique in all my pistol calibers, but maybe another powder would do the trick of reaching the factory duplication velocity of 1120 FPS?
 

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... Can't tell you how many times I've read that the 7.65 MAS is 'under-powered'. Bull cookies. Just about the same power level as the .380 ACP. Not exactly an elephant gun round, but hotter than the old .32 ACP (and much better than throwing rocks).
The problem with this ammunition is what plagued the french military weapons commissions :this perverse trend to release something typically french (which, ironically, the 7,65 L was not even as it was inspirated by the .30 Pedersen). Notably, the round had to differenciate from the 9 Luger that served as comparison, by application of the adage " you don't adopt the ammo of an ennemy ". Apparently, other countries like Belgium, Poland and even UK were not so troubled with that.
As a defense round, I consider a modern 9 Short as a good start (I am going to be blasted by the .45 afficionados) but do not forget the 7,65 L had to serve as a military round and notably as a SMG round, and there begin the troubles. While the MAS 38 SMG was extremely well conceived and made, it never had the reputation of a killer and in fact was universally despised during the war in Indochina.
 

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... Can't tell you how many times I've read that the 7.65 MAS is 'under-powered'. Bull cookies. Just about the same power level as the .380 ACP. Not exactly an elephant gun round, but hotter than the old .32 ACP (and much better than throwing rocks).
The problem with this ammunition is what plagued the french military weapons commissions :this perverse trend to release something typically french (which, ironically, the 7,65 L was not even as it was inspirated by the .30 Pedersen). Notably, the round had to differenciate from the 9 Luger that served as comparison, by application of the adage " you don't adopt the ammo of an ennemy ". Apparently, other countries like Belgium, Poland and even UK were not so troubled with that.
As a defense round, I consider a modern 9 Short as a good start (I am going to be blasted by the .45 afficionados) but do not forget the 7,65 L had to serve as a military round and notably as a SMG round, and there begin the troubles. While the MAS 38 SMG was extremely well conceived and made, it never had the reputation of a killer and in fact was universally despised during the war in Indochina.
I disagree.
I was in the French Army in the sixties, and soldiered with quite a few old hands with Indochina experience, they often bitched about the weight of the Mat 49 SMG and its ammo load, they had been sorry to give up their beloved Mas 38 for the hunk of metal in 9x19 that could not match the accuracy and handling facility of the Mas 38.

kelt
 

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Well, it is quite clear which of these two pistolets mitrailleurs would win any concours d'élégance. They are as opposed as can be. LOL.

Carcano, admirer of refined forms and elegant shapes
 
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